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NYC is a tough place

SlamDunkSlamDunk Member Posts: 632
I understand the importance of permits, especially on natural gas lines but this seems cruel. A 60 year old deli is essentially shut down because a gas pipe was put in the wrong place sixty years ago. I have said it before, NYC is a tuff place to live.

https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/ny-loesers-deli-shutdown-20191201-uxyfzs4kenfy3gmxr6cluxanlu-story.html


Comments

  • jbaskinjbaskin Member Posts: 10
    After that East Village explosion in 2015 (due to an illegal gas main tap) there was a crackdown...but of course instead of trying harder to find noncompliant installations they just made more hoops to jump through for the people who do comply. Of course who knows how dangerous this situation really is, maybe they made the right call, but the more scared people are of the inspectors the more chance they'll try to do it all illegally & quietly...
  • STEVEusaPASTEVEusaPA Member Posts: 3,481
    edited December 2
    I’m curious as to what exactly is wrong and what does it cost to actually fix it to make it...well..kosher.
    steve
  • kevink1955kevink1955 Member Posts: 69
    Doubt the piping has been there for 60 years, I do not think there were cable operated fire system gas shutdowns that far back and that pipe compound would have been laughed at by the dead men. Not getting the whole story.
  • mattmia2mattmia2 Member Posts: 389
    So what is the actual problem? is the inspection report a public record?
  • jbaskinjbaskin Member Posts: 10
    Here is the relevant violation (there are 8 open violations on the building!)
    I OBSERVED IN LOSER'S KOSHER DELI IN THE BASEMENT HAVING FUTURES ON GAS PIPE. USING BUSHING ON GAS PIPE ALSO UNION GAS PIPE .ALSO ANSUL VALVE NOT INSTALLED CORRECTLY. HOT WATER HEATER USING FLEX HOSES ON WATER
  • jbaskinjbaskin Member Posts: 10
  • mattmia2mattmia2 Member Posts: 389
    that does not sound like something that is expensive to fix...
  • kevink1955kevink1955 Member Posts: 69
    Did you know a 16 or 20 inch bike inner tube can be used to jump a missing gas meter, I did not till around 45 years ago I was installing a roof top unit in a renovated building. It was cold and the owner was pushing to get the heat on.

    He had hired his own plumber to do the gas piping from basement to roof top. We were just completing the thermostat wiring and the plumber (who was only on the job 2 hrs at most) Asked if we were ready for gas. We had no idea how he could have completed the piping and got the gas company to turn it on so quickly as we knew there was no meter this morning.

    We went to the basement with him and there was an inner tube and 2 stainless hose clamps in place of the meter. We told the owner we would not start up the unit with out the gas co passing the install, removed the wires from the disconnect and left.

    We never got a call back for the start up or any calls for service so I have no idea what happened.

    Got out of the commercial end and went to work for municipal gov shortly after and never looked back
  • STEVEusaPASTEVEusaPA Member Posts: 3,481
    That’s some poor grammar. For something so important, should not have typos, nor should it be called a hot water heater. And exactly what are 'futures on gas pipe'?
    steve
  • SlamDunkSlamDunk Member Posts: 632
    edited December 2

    That’s some poor grammar. For something so important, should not have typos, nor should it be called a hot water heater. And exactly what are 'futures on gas pipe'?

    Maybe the gas line has tee's with plugs, for future expansion?
    I agree, nothing on the report sounded like a death knell for the deli or a reason to shut off the gas.
    As far as the flex lines on the hot water heater, I have SST braided shark bite flex line on mine. Got tired of re-plumbing hot water heaters with different dimensions.
    I also agree the that news report was poorly written.

    Why not call it a hot water heater?
  • STEVEusaPASTEVEusaPA Member Posts: 3,481
    edited December 2
    SlamDunk said:


    ...Why not call it a hot water heater?

    Didn't think hot water needed to be heated. Calling it a water heater tells you all you need to know, right?

    I don't know NYC, but my guess is, getting the work done is tough enough (dealing with contractor/scheduling) but getting the inspector back and then the board of health, to approve and re-open is probably a really hard thing to make happen.
    steve
  • ChrisJChrisJ Member Posts: 10,239
    edited December 2

    SlamDunk said:


    ...Why not call it a hot water heater?

    Didn't think hot water needed to be heated. Calling it a water heater tells you all you need to know, right?

    I don't know NYC, but my guess is, getting the work done is tough enough (dealing with contractor/scheduling) but getting the inspector back and then the board of health, to approve and re-open is probably a really hard thing to make happen.
    It's a heater to provide hot water. Ergo Hotwater Heater.
    Not near as bad as VIN Number in my opinion.

    Plenty of people say hot water boiler which is just completely wrong. It doesn't boil, or who needs to heat hot water?
    What about steam boiler? Who needs to boil steam?

    Not sure how I feel about the deli. Work was done without permits and was not done to local code. I do agree with @kevink1955 though, that work doesn't look 60 years old.
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • SteamheadSteamhead Member Posts: 13,351
    I don't think we know the whole story. I wouldn't be surprised if some fatcat had their eyes on that site, and the city did this to put the existing people out of business and free up the site for redevelopment.

    I know of at least one time this has happened in Baltimore, which is at least as corrupt as NYC................
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    "Reducing our country's energy consumption, one system at a time"
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Baltimore, MD (USA) and consulting anywhere.
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/all-steamed-up-inc
  • Larry WeingartenLarry Weingarten Member Posts: 1,608
    Hi, Can't help it... the water heater heats cold water, so it's a cold water heater and a hot water maker. So, like @STEVEusaPA says, just call it a water heater B)

    Yours, Larry
  • ChrisJChrisJ Member Posts: 10,239

    Hi, Can't help it... the water heater heats cold water, so it's a cold water heater and a hot water maker. So, like @STEVEusaPA says, just call it a water heater B)

    Yours, Larry

    And what about what you call a hot water boiler?
    It doesn't boil...........
    :p
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • STEVEusaPASTEVEusaPA Member Posts: 3,481
    Definition of a boiler is:
    A fuel-burning apparatus or container for heating water.
    When it's making steam...a steam boiler.
    I, nor any of my ancestors named them...
    steve
  • SlamDunkSlamDunk Member Posts: 632
    edited December 2
    I see it now, the blue dope/tape.
    Can't be 60 yrs old, but that new pipe could have been recent, permitted work attached to 60 yr old, un-permitted work that an inspector missed.
    What was NYC plumbing life like 60 years ago? Did they have permits? Have all permits been digitized? Or,could there be a permit sitting in a box somewhere? 60 years without a problem doesn't sound like eminent danger to me.
    "Didn't think hot water had to be heated..." That's profound!
  • STEAM DOCTORSTEAM DOCTOR Member Posts: 931
    edited December 2
    Water tank thermostat is set to 140 degrees. Temperature drops to 120. Fire goes on. You are heating hot water. Just an example. After initial installation, you are heating hot or warm water( whatever definition of hot or warm may be).
  • Larry WeingartenLarry Weingarten Member Posts: 1,608
    Hi @ChrisJ , I looked it up and it seems it was part of a Soviet mis-information campaign... https://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Hot-Water+Boiler >:)
    Yours, Larry
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