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WM SGO skim

GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
Weil guys I haven’t installed a SGO before, what is the dealeeo with the skin port over the general burner area? Thanks for any tips
Gary Wilson
Wilson Services, Inc
Northampton, MA
www.wilsonph.com
[email protected]
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Comments

  • BobCBobC Posts: 4,927Member
    It depends on where the boiler manufacturer put the tapping for that skim port. Add a 90 elbow and a nipple to get it away from the gun, make sure it all has a slight pitch to water does not collect in the pipe.

    Bob
    Smith G8-3 with EZ Gas @ 90,000 BTU, Single pipe steam
    Vaporstat with a 12oz cut-out and 4oz cut-in
    3PSI gauge
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    Yes thanks I’m thinking an 18” nip to miss the burner then pull it off after the skimming

    I’ll dig at the manual maybe there’s another plug hiding somewhere
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • EzzyTEzzyT Posts: 810Member
    Gary that is the only skim port on that boiler, I do exactly what Bob mentioned when I install SGO boilers.
  • FredFred Posts: 7,733Member
    edited December 2018
    Weil only shows one 1.5" skim tapping for the SGO, located 30" above the floor and about center, above the burner opening.
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    Ezzy ok great

    It doesn’t look a little odd? Maybe I’ll skim and just leave a nip under the boiler, Tef tape the plug back on

    Thanks
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • Our version:



    The smallest size or two only comes with one supply tapping, btw...

    Good luck!


    New England SteamWorks
    Service, Installation, & Restoration of Steam Heating Systems
    newenglandsteamworks.com
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    Cool I always though you needed good flow, the boiler drain does a good job?

    And while I have you on the phone, is there a reason you use bm and not ci?
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    The old hog
    I’ll get pics once the Elec is done
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • EzzyTEzzyT Posts: 810Member
    Gary after we’re done skimming we just install a 6” nipple with cap and call it a day.
  • Dave0176Dave0176 Posts: 1,022Member
    GW said:

    Cool I always though you needed good flow, the boiler drain does a good job?



    And while I have you on the phone, is there a reason you use bm and not ci?

    Gary, Ryan uses BM because as he told me it’s the smaller band and therefore the use of a smaller wrench. Me I love Cast Iron, it just looks tough, plus that’s what the dead plumbers used. Plus my supply house carries almost every size cast fitting up to 6”
    DL Mechanical LLC Heating, Cooling and Plumbing 732-266-5386
    Specializing in Steam Heating, Serving the residents of New Jersey
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/dl-mechanical-llc

    https://m.facebook.com/DL-Mechanical-LLC-315309995326627/?ref=content_filter

    I cannot force people to spend money, I can only suggest how to spend it wisely.......
  • EBEBRATT-EdEBEBRATT-Ed Posts: 5,280Member
    That old boiler looks a little tired.....looks like I feel on a Friday night.

    I like malleable, smaller wrenches and less likely to slip than on cast malleable rated for more pressure. + You can't use cast iron on gas and we always end up with two many extra fittings. Can't put a two footer on 3" cast but it will go on malleable. Smaller wrenches mean I get less tired. I use a small wrench to crank it part way then get the big wrench. No reason to struggle with a big wrench until you need it. my 2cents
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    Slipping wrench syndrome, lol yesterday on the SGO install I had a slip and I thought for sure I was going to see the old red leak, to my surprise and delight just a wee bit of red stuff. Dang that hurt

    I hear you on the Mal. But it sure is a pain when you need to get at an old pipe that you can’t obliterate the old fittings. Yesterday we tried two guys with 24” wrench each, nada. Then we tried out 5’ breaker pipe on the 24” wrench, zilch. Then we put a 10’ piece of 1 1/2” into the remaining old 2” and it came free, about 12 feet total of leverage works every time

    Thanks for the comment on my Weil McLain voyage
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • EBEBRATT-EdEBEBRATT-Ed Posts: 5,280Member
    @GW

    I am too old for a lot of pounding smashing and yanking. I take the easy way out an angle grinder with a face shield and gloves and a box of cutting disks.

    With a little practice you get really good at making a few cuts to relieve the pressure without hitting the threads and the cutting disks cut like butter rap it with a hammer and unscrew it.

    We are doing a 23 section Burnham in a school in Amherst, saw one of your trucks on Chestnut St I have to post some pics on that but now I am off the track

    The Burnham has 6 4" uptakes to the header which we are trying to save. The original installer screwed them in with "expando" pipe dope which is a powder you mix with water dries hard as a rock cant unwrench anything. Just made some cuts in the boiler with a grinder and popped them out, not bad

    I usually make a cut in the fitting parallel with the end of the pipe deeper than the pipe enters the fitting so I don't hit the threads. Then 1 slice in the fitting parallel to the pipe as deep as possible without hitting the threads. Then drive an old screwdriver in the last cut it will expand the fitting and you can unscrew it.

    practice makes perfect

  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    Thanks Ed good to know, we have used a sawzall many times; the process can be gingerly. If you have minute some day can you post a pic of your tooling ? Just curious what the grinder wheel looks like 9and the grinder0
    Chestnut St- maybe my service man- I don't recall doing an install on that street recently. If you see Ford van, a pickup and a Tahoe- that the install crew!
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • Dave0176Dave0176 Posts: 1,022Member
    @GW I don’t try to remove old pipe from fittings, as you’ve found out it’s not easy, and my thought is I might be damaging something else down the line. If I have to remove a pipe I cut it by the fitting leaving about a half inch of pipe sticking out, then I’ll make two cuts in the pipe of course without cutting into the threads, but just enough, then I get a good sized cape chisel and knock out that piece of pipe, then a good shot to the side of the remaining pipe which collapses it in and you can basically remove it by hand.

    Removing old cast fittings, I use my angle grinder and grind as much through the seem of the fitting without damaging the threads of the pipe I intend to keep, then beat a big cold chisel into the cut seem and 99% of the time the whole fitting splits in half.
    DL Mechanical LLC Heating, Cooling and Plumbing 732-266-5386
    Specializing in Steam Heating, Serving the residents of New Jersey
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/dl-mechanical-llc

    https://m.facebook.com/DL-Mechanical-LLC-315309995326627/?ref=content_filter

    I cannot force people to spend money, I can only suggest how to spend it wisely.......
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    Thanks Dave I really do prefer to smash- it's very fast. I whack the fitting and get a small crack, then i bash the 'other' side of the fitting and I've never had an issue. But you're right- at times one needs to cut the old bugger out. i'm just not that fast at that procedure.
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • EBEBRATT-EdEBEBRATT-Ed Posts: 5,280Member
    What @Dave0176 said is the usual procedure that works well as well. Depends on weather your saving a pipe or a fitting on how you approach it.

    I just use a standard 4 1/2" angle grinder with an .045 cutting disk. My grinder is corded but all the young guy's at or shop use nothing with a cord now.

    I also like the small Milwaukee "Hackzall" it's uses std sawzall blades and is light weight and easier to control cutting inside a fitting to remove a pipe. Mine is a 12 volt with the upgraded batteries
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    Cool I will check out those disk wheels thanks
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • Dave0176Dave0176 Posts: 1,022Member

    What @Dave0176 said is the usual procedure that works well as well. Depends on weather your saving a pipe or a fitting on how you approach it.

    I just use a standard 4 1/2" angle grinder with an .045 cutting disk. My grinder is corded but all the young guy's at or shop use nothing with a cord now.

    I also like the small Milwaukee "Hackzall" it's uses std sawzall blades and is light weight and easier to control cutting inside a fitting to remove a pipe. Mine is a 12 volt with the upgraded batteries

    Yeah I got an old Hilti corded 4-1/2" grinder, I pulled the guard off and run a 6" X .045 disk, its a bit dangerous but it works great.
    DL Mechanical LLC Heating, Cooling and Plumbing 732-266-5386
    Specializing in Steam Heating, Serving the residents of New Jersey
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/dl-mechanical-llc

    https://m.facebook.com/DL-Mechanical-LLC-315309995326627/?ref=content_filter

    I cannot force people to spend money, I can only suggest how to spend it wisely.......
  • EBEBRATT-EdEBEBRATT-Ed Posts: 5,280Member
    @Dave0176

    a 6" wheel would be better I will have to try that, can't get deep enough with the 4 1/2 sometimes
    Face shield for sure those wheels can shatter if you get back in a groove crooked, it hasen't got me yet but they can get nasty
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    made it a little better, one riser became two risers, got the vents a little more situated. I still am working on my venting and how to differentiate costs between me and my fellow competitors








    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • Danny ScullyDanny Scully Posts: 1,097Member
    How’d you make out with the skim tapping @gw?
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    We just tossed on an 1 1-2” x 18 and a 90 and another 1 1/2” x 18 into a bucket.

    We took it all apart when we were done and plugged it back up

    I stopped by yesterday and there goop in the glass so we will hit it again
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • ethicalpaulethicalpaul Posts: 557Member
    Fantastic improvement!!!

    I have a question for you if I may. The flexible conduit is really nice (and maybe required by code?) but doesn’t it make it more difficult to clean the pigtail?

    Do you have to unhook the conduit, and the wires, then spin the tee (with the p-trol and gauge still attached to it) to remove it? Maybe that only takes a few minutes once a year and makes the cost of a union to be not worth it? Thanks!
    1 pipe Utica 112 in Cedar Grove, NJ, 1913 coal > oil > NG
  • Danny ScullyDanny Scully Posts: 1,097Member
    I would leave a long nipple and cap @GW. Why bother with getting a plug out? You’ll curse yourself if it needs skimming in years from now.
  • EBEBRATT-EdEBEBRATT-Ed Posts: 5,280Member
    Nice job Gary
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    Ethicalpaul well that’s how the boiler came. But I see your point. What’s a good way to deal with that? I suppose a union would be uncool? And please share how your screen name came about 😄
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    Danny yes I understand, I just think it looks odd, maybe vanity has a grip on me lol
    We taped the plug to hopefully it would come off, or you think it would bake on?
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • ethicalpaulethicalpaul Posts: 557Member
    > @GW said:
    > Ethicalpaul well that’s how the boiler came. But I see your point. What’s a good way to deal with that? I suppose a union would be uncool? And please share how your screen name came about 😄

    I put a 1/4” brass union on mine but I don’t know anything, I’m just a homeowner who wants to make it easy on myself to be able to check the pigtail in the future 😅

    I used to fix stuff in college like VCRs, old electrical stuff, etc for friends, and I would charge $10 but only if the fix worked, so someone called me that. And I had a philosophy minor so I liked it. Years later I used it as a business name for database/computer contracting I would do for small businesses. If any of you steam folks need any computer or system advice, drop me a message. I owe everyone on this Wall.

    > Danny yes I understand, I just think it looks odd, maybe vanity has a grip on me lol

    I think it (the capped nipple) looks like the installer is super awesome and left someone in the future a way to skim 😃 Will you have to remove all the controls and the panel (jacket it’s called?) in order to skim it when you go back? 😬

    Thanks for sharing your photos!! And it looks so pro!!
    1 pipe Utica 112 in Cedar Grove, NJ, 1913 coal > oil > NG
  • FredFred Posts: 7,733Member
    It looks Great @GW. I agree with the others, put a nipple and cap on the skim port and leave it. Everyone will thank you for years to come. Also, most of us use a brass union on the Pressuretrol/gauge set up. So much easier than having to un-wire and rewire it.

    One other comment: You used Gorton #1's on each main. I assume they are very short mains? If not, those may not be enough.
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    Fred yes hence my comment “still trying to get my venting ducks in a row “ or whatever I typed. No one around here does piddly squat with venting. I just need to get that whole thing under control—-as in- no one else in my area makes a one riser job into a two riser job, but I did do that, so I should just get over the hump and start putting money into bigger vents. I need to start working on my selling skills with steam.
    No one else around here reworks the dry returns to get away from the horizontal to vertical slam on the main vents, but I tried to make that better too.

    Charlie obviously not included in that general comment
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    Paul Lol I see.

    I have computer questions daily it seems my son is my go to at home and thankfully our office computers stay pretty dialed in.

    I’ll see if I can add a union now that the steam people have spoken
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • EBEBRATT-EdEBEBRATT-Ed Posts: 5,280Member
    Use Never Seize with Teflon tape and anything will come apart even if cooked by high pressure steam. My brother is a steam fireman boiler operator put me on to that. He worked in the same plant for 18 years and replaced the same valves more than once years apart.
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    @Dave0176 Dave what kind of wheel are you using? Diamond? the regular? I was at the depot the other day but couldn't decide which wheel to try. plus i forgot what arbor size i have; I'll figure that one out.
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    my 12' breaker bar- notice my leading leg-foot in case something pops LOL


    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • ethicalpaulethicalpaul Posts: 557Member
    Did the house twist on the foundation? 😅
    1 pipe Utica 112 in Cedar Grove, NJ, 1913 coal > oil > NG
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    LOL I would have needed another 4 feet
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
  • Dave0176Dave0176 Posts: 1,022Member
    GW said:

    @Dave0176 Dave what kind of wheel are you using? Diamond? the regular? I was at the depot the other day but couldn't decide which wheel to try. plus i forgot what arbor size i have; I'll figure that one out.

    From HD I would get the regular Diablo wheel. Right now I’m using the 0.45 DeWalt regular wheel but the big 6” without the guard.
    DL Mechanical LLC Heating, Cooling and Plumbing 732-266-5386
    Specializing in Steam Heating, Serving the residents of New Jersey
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/dl-mechanical-llc

    https://m.facebook.com/DL-Mechanical-LLC-315309995326627/?ref=content_filter

    I cannot force people to spend money, I can only suggest how to spend it wisely.......
  • EBEBRATT-EdEBEBRATT-Ed Posts: 5,280Member
    edited January 15
    Yeah the .045 wheels. Any brand is ok . I tried the diamond wheel and don't like them. I use the 4 1/2" on a small grinder. I like @Dave0176 idea on the 6" wheel for bigger stuff. Most all grinders are 7/8 hole arbors

    Most of the time u can't use a guard so a faceshield & gloves are a good idea
  • GWGW Posts: 3,353Member
    would this do the job

    Lenox Tools 1972923 METALMAX Diamond Edge Cutoff Wheel, 6" x 7/8"
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    www.wilsonph.com
    [email protected]
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