Buderous GB142/45: Low Loss Header Manifold "FAILURE"- What to do now?

Heatmeister_2

Guys, I need some help and have attached a picture of the problem with my leaky fitting.

It has been quite awhile that I have been dealing with a very slow leak with my GB142. However, I am tired of dealing with it. After some research here and others sites, I have come to the realization that my leaky compression connection is NOT anamoly. Hence I have be been in contact with Buderus, only to find out that Buderus takes no ownership and states that my issue is we is with Watts who made the fitting. So I need some help taking the proper course of action. Your assistance i appreciated.

1) I have read on this forum, that this issue can be common with the compression fitting, and in some cases, may just need to be taken apart and put back together albeit with plenty of paste to prevent a future leak. Is this true and if so, is the least expensive course of action.

2) I have also read and now learned from Buderus that the copper "Low Loss Header Manifold" made by Watts was an part used in "early" Buderus GB142 installs, only to be replaced with a steel version. However, you will see in my correspondence with Buderus, they seem think the "Free Replacement" offer was for a limited time, and now must be purchased at a cost ~$895 ( I am using approximate pricing to conform with forum policy)

So below is todays correspondence with Buderus.... still wating to hear from Watts. Can somebody explain in lay mands terms what I should do and is this normal?

Email #1

Dear Sir,

One of our technicians looked at your photo. You have the old style copper low loss header manifold installed on this boiler. At that time there were no dielectric unions attached to the low loss header pipes. The leak is coming from the compression fitting.

Here are the prices for the compression fitting (aka double nipple) and the steel Low Loss Header if you want to order them through us:


7-597-7 Double nipple ~$58.00 (each)
7-738-002-937 GB142 1 1/2" Low Loss Header Kit V2 ~$895.00


Email #2

Dear Sir,

I checked with Technical Support and we did not have a recall on this product. The low loss header was manufactured by Watts. Watts offered a replacement program from September 2012 until December 2013. That has now expired. You will have to either see if your contractor can repair your copper one with a new compression fitting or you will have to purchase the new steel low loss header.

lchmb

I've only replaced them with the steel header...During the winter I would hate to chance taking it apart and not having the needed parts to repair it...you could have a service tech bring them with them but may pay a hefty restocking fee if they dont use them. Then of course if it starts leaking a week later......

Heatmeister_2

All clear. I guess what I am trying to figure out is how much leverage do I have with Watts. They had a replacement program in place, albeit in relative terms, for a very short period of time. (Edit: Watts offered the replacement part from under a replacement program from September 2012 to December 2013) And unless you had problem with the part during the period, you would have never known the part was available for free. With the steel header costing nearly $1000, this seems unreasonable.

Has anyone dealt with Watts to get this covered under the replacement or is the customer supposed to roll over and just fork over the money for such and expensive replacement part when the original clearly has design flaws.

Jamie Hall

Your biggest problem is going to be to prove that there was an actual design flaw, and that the replacement was not simply a product improvement.

GW

Yes we stock those parts. We've had good success getting them fixed up

Ironman

I doubt if you'll have any recourse at all. We had leaks on that fitting and cleaned it up and re-used it.

Watts made the manifold for Buderus, but as far as I know, they never offered any warranty to the end user. That's always lies with the equipment manufacturer. There are several "vendor" parts on any piece of equipment. They are sold in bulk to the equipment manufacturer with no warranty by the vendor; the manufacturer offers that.

Heatmeister_2

Ironman said:

I doubt if you'll have any recourse at all. We had leaks on that fitting and cleaned it up and re-used it.

Watts made the manifold for Buderus, but as far as I know, they never offered any warranty to the end user. That's always lies with the equipment manufacturer. There are several "vendor" parts on any piece of equipment. They are sold in bulk to the equipment manufacturer with no warranty by the vendor; the manufacturer offers that.

Good to hear about your success cleaning and reusing the part.

Also,according to Buderus, Watts offered the replacement part from under a replacement program from September 2012 to December 2013. However, I have not yet had the discussion with Watts. After 45 minutes on hold with their customer support, I gave up for the day, but plan to try again tomorrow.

hot_rod

It looks like just the compression connection that is leaking, not sure replacing the entire LLH is needed? I'll bet it could be disassembled, cleaned and pipe doped into compliance

I'm not a huge fan of a compression connection on a rigid pipe like that plated brass assembly. It seems like a tough connection when exposed to the thermal expansion and contraction. The ferrule never really bites into a hard metal like it can on pex or copper tube.

The early Weil Ultras had the same issue with compression adapters on the galvanized piping they supplied with them. They could actually cause the nut to split from the expansion movement.