emergency help!!

bbillcee

everytime i touch the freaking plumbing in this house!!!

anyway i had a leak from the packing nut on one of the rads so i put some graphite packing on there and the freaking nut cracked! im attaching a photo... can i jerry rig it with the graphite and cracked nut or will steam be spraying all over? If i attempt to change the valve do u thing there is a chance i could get that reducing nipple relatively easy out of the rad?? I took the packing nut to the LPS and they said ill be driving around all day to try to find a nut....what should i do!!??


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Jamie Hall

oops...

First off, the valve and the "nipple" coming out of the radiator are a matched pair. Don't even think about changing the valve without getting the spud out -- and getting the spud out can be really really difficult.

You may be able to get away with some sort of jury rig sealing around the valve stem -- if your boiler pressure is low, and kept low.

SlamDunk

First, arrest the situation by fully closing the valve. Second, go buy an oil filled electric radiator from a big box store. Third, find what you need and replace. You dont need a leaky steam valve.

Fred

With the weather the way i is, I'd be incline to buy a complete new valve (looks like a Hoffman maybe 1-1/4). and use the nut off of it. Save the new valve for later use.

bbillcee

got the valve off....should i try to back the reducing nipple out or cut the nipple that is coming out of the reducer?

JUGHNE

Assuming you need heat badly:
Band-aid Repair options that I'm familiar with include:
1....If the nut is cracked on the side you might put the packing in and start the nut and then put a stainless steel hose clamp on the bonnet packing nut and nudge it a little tighter with pliers. (have seen this work for 3 years on a 2" valve)
2....Just shut off the valve tightly and not have heat at that rad, you would be lucky if the valve shuts off completely. Assuming this is a one pipe rad and without 100% shut off it would fill with condensate eventually.
3...Remove the valve and cap the pipe, (if band-aids don't work the valve will have to be removed anyway.)
The rad spud and valve are brass screwed into and onto steel. They usually have a good marriage and don't want to be separated easily. Saws, chisels, smelly penetrating oils and sometimes fire comes into play. Search this site for rad spud removal and look on U-tube also. Just don't cut the threads of the parts you will re-use. ALWAYS use 2 pipe wrenches on the valve. IMHO

Or call a pro.

Fred

Don't even try it. Go but yourself a new valve as I mentioned above and use the nut off of it while your at it, bu a cap for that steam pipe, in case ou have to cap it off and turn the heat bck on.

JUGHNE

I am really a slow writer; everyone is ahead of me. I would buy the cap and a new valve. Cap the riser get the heat back on. That spud is brass and will cut easier than the steel bushing it is screwed into. Look for a video on u-tube. Get hacksaw blades also.

Fred

I wouldn't cut that spud off. The only problem is the Nut on th valve. Either get a new valve and se the nut or find an old valve that you can take the nut off of. In the meantime cap the pipe.

icesailor

GENTLY!!!!!

You don't treat your dog, cat or partner that roughly.

Get the narrowest hose clamp you can get and still fit around the cracked nut. If that piece of packing on the top of the stem is what you used, I personally think it is too far and should have had a string removed. I personally would have wound up some Teflon tape rather than string.

It isn't how tight you can get it, it's how tight do you have to make it to stop leaking. For me, a pair of 6" water pump pliers is all I would have used.

If you didn't split the nut in half, spin the nut down a good amount before it starts to make up on the packing. Spin it down a ways and put the clamp on the nut. Tighten the nut REASONABLY TIGHT!!!. Don't use a 3' pipe wrench on it.

Some of us wonder why there are so many bodybuilders in the screw pipe trades. Its like it seems to be that it takes a 3' pipe wrench to tighten up a 1/2" black plug into a fitting that you need to be able to remove in the future. It isn't like you can't tighten it more if it weeps.

KC_Jones

To the OP if you do replace valve and spud you will also need a spud wrench if you don't have one. There are several ways to get the old spud out, but getting the new one in requires a spud wrench which is a specialty tool that not every one has.

Gordy

I like Freds Idea IF you can find a valve. Simple

bbillcee

got it out all ok!! woo hoo ...new is installed but not sure its gonna hold because i was only able to get 3-4 full turns on the valve to the nipple sticking out the floor....if i went anymore it would throw off alignment with rad....i loaded it with wick and dope so it was pretty tight.....heat coming up now....lets see what happens...youtube save the days as well as u guys......if it doesnt hold any suggestions?

bbillcee

image upload no registration

Fred

Good for you!

bbillcee

Hatterasguy said:

Nice work!!

Didn't figure you were going to accomplish that in two hours!!

3-4 turns is plenty if it was reasonably tight. The pressure is minimal.

well it survived the the first heat cycle! the key I got from the video i watched was not to even try to loosen them, hacksawed then chiseled and spun right out! I surprised myself on this one! now to make the thread on balancing the system

Abracadabra

I keep stuff like this in my truck for emergency repairs like this:

http://cleanfit.com/blue-monster-compression-seal-tape.shtml

bbillcee

Abracadabra said:

I keep stuff like this in my truck for emergency repairs like this:

http://cleanfit.com/blue-monster-compression-seal-tape.shtml

wow that stuff looks great!

JUGHNE

Has anyone tried this; band-aids with benefits: Probably most 1 pipe steam rad valves are never used or never seal completely. How about removing the bonnet, completely remove the stem and washer disc. Then drill and tap the top of the stem hole to just screw in a brass plug? The added benefit could be a port to install an air vent for the riser. Crazy or what????

nicholas bonham-carter

Good idea, and I have contemplated, but never done that.
I doubt that any packing nuts are interchangeable.--NBC

icesailor

Another poster example of why it isn't a good idea to try to replace old valves on radiators with new ones. The new ones never fit.

You would be wise when things warm up to take that valve off and double wrap the threads with Blue Monster TFPE tape. Put some Rectorseal #5 on the male threads, inside the valve, and on the tape. If you can't wash Rectorseal #5 off your clothes, it probably won't get washed out of threads. Even PVC cleaner barely touches it.

If that is single pipe steam, I personally would be marking around the radiator feet with a pencil and chiseling out the floor to drop the radiator down a snitch to get more pressure on the threads. If it is single pipe, it will improve the flow. But screw up the alignment. When and if you do, you MUST use a pry bar to lever up the bottom of the valve so that the two union faces are equal to each other and tighten the union nut by hand until it starts to get tight. Tighten the nut "finger tight" with a pair of 12" water pump pliers until it tightens up. That way, you're not using the slopes of the union faces to align the union. And destroying the ground joint face of the union. Like happened on the last one. Unions and any ground joint connections MUST be pulled hand tight together before cranking home. Unless you like leaks.

Once you wreck a union face, you might as well replace it. Very little can salvage it.

Opinions are my own.

bbillcee

Its in my apartment so I will keep a close eye,, any leaks and will do as you advise thanx for input

icesailor

And if you had used multiple wraps of TFPE tape, it might have not leaked at all.

My son called me last night. He told me about a job he is working on where he had to move some disaster copper heating pipes, He put it all back together and tested the whole zone to 140# PSI air pressure with an air compressor. He left it for 2 days. It didn't drop even a half pound. He filled it with water and put the zone back on line. The next day, he had a leak on a joint that wasn't soldered. The solder paste held the fitting together for 48 hours with 140# PSIG of air.

ChicagoCooperator

My entire building originally had no valves - convector damper control only! Could one just eliminate the valve entirely (though if you had to remove the radiator temporarily it could be a hassle I suppose).

Fred

On a 1 pipe system, I think a full port valve on the radiator supply line, near the Main is much more reliable than the valves at the radiators. Those valves are so old they don't seem to seal well enough to allow the radiator to be removed with any assurance that the valve is actually sealing. I'm sure the retrofit to put ball valves on would be a huge undertaking and probably not worth it unless the run-out had to be replaced anyway. Just my opinion.