Relocating steam boiler to first floor

birdsalljoed

My customer has a residential steam boiler in the basement of a house that is prone to flooding. He would like to relocate the boiler and the near piping (header, Hartford loop, etc) to the first floor to protect the equipment. His mains would still be located in the basement. Any suggestions or reference material would be appreciated.

Jamie Hall

Well... you can do it, of course. The steam will, as always, go from higher pressure to lower pressure.

However.

You will need to have a wet return in the basement, with drips from every low point that is created by the setup. There may be several of these, depending on how the system is piped. That wet return will go into a condensate receiver, and then you will need to have a boiler feed pump -- activated by a level control on the boiler -- to return that condensate to the boiler.

Now. In principle you keep that pump on the first floor, too, and use a jet pump in the basement. That would keep all your electrics up on the first floor. I would NOT count on using any form of self-priming pump on the first floor, nor would I count on a foot valve in the basement to maintain your prime. If you do use a jet pump, it will have to be derated -- a lot -- if it uses boiler water as the motive fluid, which you would pretty well have to to avoid over filling the boiler, since the boiler water will be hot.

RobG

Any chance of waterproofing, fixing grade issues to prevent the flooding? It would probably be less expensive.

Rob

jumper

Dry well and/or retention tank. More foolproof.

JStar

You could keep all of the main and radiator piping as it is in the basement. Then install F&T traps with check valves at the end of the mains/returns to lift water back up to the boiler. The only problem may be on start-ups, if all of the condensate hasn't been sent back. It could settle in the mains and hammer a bit. Something to think about, though!

Paul48

How much water are you talking?

JStar

Paul48 said:

How much water are you talking?

That is a question! I don't know if it's a good or bad question, because I don't have a good or bad answer yet. Still thinking about it.

I'm imagining in my mind's steam-eye that most of the condensate will be returned upwards as long as there is pressure in the system to push it up. Let's say that the cycle ends and the steam pressure starts to creep down. How high are we lifting the water? Maybe it's 1ft from the main to the floor, and another 1ft to the Hartford Loop (which would be ESSENTIAL). So, there's 2ft total. We'll need a little less than 1psi to make it possible; 13.7 ounces to be exact. If you were to cycle the boiler between 14 ounces and 24 ounces (0.5 to 1.5psi), it would not be a problem during normal operation.

So, what happens during abnormal operation, or long off cycles? Who can calculate exactly how much water will be left over at the end of a cycle? How much water is returning from the radiators?

If I were to attempt this theory, I would use a 2" pipe from the F&T traps to the Hartford Loop to gain more holding volume for leftover condensate. My gut is telling me that it would still cause problems, but I would love to find it.

Steamhead

Is this a one-pipe or two-pipe system?

nicholas bonham-carter

I think the best thing to do would be to raise the boiler off the basement floor, with some flood protection.
A drop header, and a Vaporstat, here would be able to cope with the a dimention having been reduced.--NBC