No heat: no call to boiler

treker2557

Hello, I have a fairly old steam boiler with 1 pipe radiators.  Model 2D412 by Durkirk Radiator Company.   My thermostat doesn't call to boiler when I turn it even to the max setting.  However if i touch my wires together (red and white) right before they go into the pressuretrol  that run to the thermostat it will kick on and stay on.  I don't know much about HVAC but my system is pretty simple.  Thermostat to pressuretrol connected to black pigtail, pressure gauge, water cut off, gas valve, burners.  I'm assuming that the pressuretrol is bad needs to be replaces but I just had it replaced last year when I moved in.  The pressure gauge reads zero and I attempted to clean the pig tail out by using a zip tie to clear any possible blockage.  I read online that the old style pig tails can go bad and allowing steam to reach the pressuretrol causing the pressuretol to go bad. 



Also if it is the pressuretrol should I replace it with a vapostat and a brass pig tail?  Any help would be appreciated.

jpf321

we need clarity...

when you take the leads off your p-trol and touch them together it works?

did you try to fiddle with the p-trol screws up/down as a test?

did you press down/up on the little see-saw plate inside the p-trol to see if the switch is clicking? (I'm assuming this is a microswitch and not a mercury since it's new)



pigtails are pigtails by design, old ones vs. new ones still protect the equipment. pigtails should only be BRASS period. an annotated picture or two might help.



if the p-trol needs replacement, and you are considering a v-stat, you still need a proper p-trol for code requirements (and perhaps a manual reset one at that) and the two



funny, I found this board last year because my p-trol was flaking out, for some reason that i don't recall, i did not need to buy another after i fiddled with it, but the need to understand what was going on, brought me to this board.



has this worked at all this season? are you on the proper screws inside the p-trol (perhaps when you were cleaning your pigtail you mis-screwed it?)

treker2557

Clarity response

Actually its the leads right before they enter the  p-trol before they go to the p-trol then to the water cutt-off.



I have a micro-switch p-trol and I adjusted the cut in and the differential and fiddled with the see-saw plate trying to make it click as well and no luck.  I even switched  in the old p-trol that I had from last year that I replaced since you had to press the see-saw plate to make the boiler kick on and that one didn't work either. 



It looks like I will have to replace my pigtail then.



I attached the wires back properly to p-trol.  I make sure there was contact at the brass screws and even tried reversing the leads just in case.



This is the first I turned the system on for the season.  I cleaned the burners and pilot shroud and aligned my pilot, cleaned my glass tube, and flushed the system.  When I tried to call to the boiler no luck.



I have also attached pictures of the p-trol and the boiler system



I"m only starting to learn about steam heating and never knew how

important proper maintenance and control of system is.  My dad bought

this house and he is clueless about everything.  The house was

originally rented for years before he purchased it so the boiler,

radiators vents and just about everything in the house needed repair of

course.  I only replaced all the bad radiator vents and only this year

cleaned the boiler and adjusted the badly mis-aligned pilot.  Now I want

to try and start regulating the system properly and this forum has been

fairly helpful. 

jpf321

if you...

put your meter across the p-trol switch, push the see-saw plate (up down) does your meter show you the switch opening and closing properly?



I really think you need a pro in there. you may very well have another SAFETY switch, quite possibly part of your gas SAFETY system (since you recently worked on it) which is failed. if your meter shows your p-trol working properly, it is not the p-trol.



as well, i think that all your wiring should be in armored sheathing by code. I'm not a pro so I won't be able to respond too much more at the risk of your SAFETY.

treker2557

p-trol tested response

I tested the p-trol and when I press the see-saw lever it spikes to 3.5 volts.



I figured that the wiring should be armored and I plan an upgrading the boiler this year.  Do you suggest anything else that I should do besides upgrade wire to armored and the vapostat I plan on installing?  Some people on the forum suggested a digital readout of your water usage.  Is that a good idea to have installed?



Also, any ideas on how to adjust the pilot flame on my system.  Their are 2 screws that hold it in place and then the shroud ontop of the bracket but I can't even seem to turn the shroud.  I don't have an adjustment knob and lost on how to correct the flame.



Looks like I need a pro though to come in.  Really hoping to avoid that cost right now but temp dropped 15 + degrees in the past 3 days and staying that way for awhile.

Charlie from wmass

there is a major part missing in the photos

there should be a plate over the top of those burners to keep the flames in the boiler. You need a pro before someone gets hurt. I am not being an alarmist I am quite serious. Thise rust stains indicate something is not as it should be.

treker2557

nope I have the part

I took the shield off for the picture.  It's not missing. 



Thanks though

Jamie Hall

Something is clearly

amiss somewhere.  3.5 volts across an open pressuretrol switch is a rather odd number.



Assuming that you don't want to get a pro in -- a move which I very very very highly recommend -- and that you have a reasonably good knowledge of electricity and the controls on your burner, consider: all of the safety switches and the pressuretrol are wired in series.  That means all the switches must be closed for the burner to get any power and run.



The pressuretrol may not be the only switch!  In fact, it probably isn't.  Is there a low water cut off?  Is it closed?  Is the pressuretrol closed when the pressure is off?  Is there a second pressuretrol with a manual reset?  Is there a second LWCO with a manual reset?  Are the burner safeties closed and operating properly?  And so on...



You can check the various switches that you can find with an ohmmeter -- not a voltmeter.  Turn off the power to the system first.  Then at each control in turn, disconnect one wire and check the resistance across the switch; it should be 0 if the switch is closed.



But I suggest a pro...

treker2557

Amiss Still

I have alot of experience with electrical components and wiring.  So I went ahead with your suggestions and tested everything in a series for resistance. 



The 3.5 volts was when the pressuretrol clicked over for a closed circuit



I have no other switches besides the pressuretol and low water cutt off.  Both read closed when tested.  I have no other resets or switches or any electrical power going into the system.  Just the single thermostat wiring. 



I also checked the resistance at the gas safety valve and that checked out ok.  I"m not sure what is going on but I called a pro today and he is coming in two or three days to take a look at the system.   I'll post what was wrong to let everyone know.



Thanks for all the help from everyone.  I greatly appreciated.