Homeowner angry at Viesmann

Mark Hunt_4

No

But I have never seen one running on the road where I live. How many John Deer tractors have you seen on the side of the roads where you live? Must be John Deer is as good as a Rolls?

joel_19

Yes Dan

I agree kind of.... and we do stock ALOT of parts the vitodens gas valve in question is probably on our shelf along with a jillion other little parts for it. I also have everything for the chassis burner and most everything for Triangle Tube.

The real question is WHY???? Why can autoparts stores carry most anything or get it virtually overnight and make a profit and a Transfer House says it is impossable?
"Not for foreign cars" Bull Cucka I say. In my garrage is a 25 yold Datsun 280ZX and I can have virtually any part on that thing on my doorstep in 24HRS. Same thing with my 16 yold 300ZX.

Now if my local car service guy doesn't have to stock parts for every type of car he works on why do I local heat guy have to stock parts for every furnasty,boiler and A/C I've ever seen?

I layed on the floor of a clients house all night because i couldn't get a gas valve but could keep it relighting by banging it with a wrench. It was an AMERICAN boiler a BLUE one. Keep in mind this is Eastern Mass and how many transfer houses are there???? Thousands of BLUE boilers in a 3o mile radius neatly stacked in boxes and not one valve.

Why couldn't that company have the cojones to say, "Hey transfer house you want 100k in boilers no problem buy 10k in parts to go with it "

joel_19

Bill?

if I stock all parts then why can't i buy a boiler,A/C etc. from the factory what exactly does the wholesaler do for me?
Why am I paying their markup? when the freight company could bring the same thing right to my door as to the wholesalers?

Better still your argument would say that the local repair garrage should stock parts for every make and model of car which they obviously do not do.

Unknown

Right,,,

So we'll eliminate the warehouse and ALWAYS have to wait for parts to be shipped in. Nobody is saying anybody has to stock everything. All I'm saying is if you know parts can be tough to get for something that you sell, it's not a bad idea to have a few things on the shelf for emergencies. To me it seems like common sense. Especially if your region is a bit on the remote side.

I'd like to know how the purchase of the Viessmann was initiated. Did the HO see it on the net and tell his contractor, "I want a Viessmann!" or did the contractor actively pursue selling him the brand because that's what he sells?

Derheatmeister

MPF.His contractor apparently has 20 Viessmanns Installed.

Tony_23

JD

John Deere is BETTER than a Rolls

4x4, AC & heated cab, stereo, nice bucket seat, good view.
Not the fastest ride, but able to take "shortcuts"

Unknown

Thanks!

m

Dave Yates (GrandPAH)

Dan

We carry a huge inventory. I'd rather we didn't because in PA we pay taxes every year on the value of that inventory. But, we do feel an obligation to service what we sell.

It's a fine line that's no longer fine - as in thin - it's very fat and growing by leaps and bounds. Time was we never had to leave someone without heating or air conditioning, but as you know all of the equipment (or almost all) has evolved from simple parts to complicated components with lots of circuit boards and/or computerized component controllers.

We no longer work in a plyers/4-way-screwdriver/flashlight mechanical-component diagnostic-world: it's a digital analyzer(s) highly-technical chasing-electrons that operate mechanical-components (often micro-sized on PC boards - as in - not repairable/replaceable components) technician's world. Those who chose to stick with the old technology, thinking this new-fangled stuff would be a fad, have been left in the dust. The one-size-fits-all gas valve can serve as just one of many examples of how the mechanical/electronic marriage has caused our inventory to mushroom. Our business is 108 years young & there are items in our inventory with century-old dust on them.

So, we maintain an inventory of small electric heaters and window A/C units to tide customers over until we can have parts air-freighted for next-day delivery. We are a service firm, so we see lots of equipment we don't sell too. No one can afford to stock every part required to maintain everything they service unless they choose to specialize and focus on a narrow segment of what consumers purchase or have installed in their homes and businesses.

Supply houses have, in many cases, stockholders to answer to at years end. They are a business that needs to be profitable and I understand the "turn" thing. Doesn't mean I'm not frustrated by the lack of inventory - I often am. Fortunately, the Internet has provided all of us the means to by-pass snail-like chains of communication and forge lines of communication that often lead directly to folks who can expidite parts - and then bill those parts through our local wholesalers so that the line of distribution for the money-chain is not disrupted.

This thread has been interesting and as you & I saw, first hand, at the Viessmann factory in Germany, their ability to pull and ship parts is state of the art and incredibly fast. Something went horribly wrong in the chain of communication in this case and exactly what or who is responsible isn't clear, yet Viessmann is being singled out for the target. My own personal experience with them runs contrary to this gent's experience.

An old saw about honey, flies & vinegar comes to mind.

Home Depot Employee

Totally disagree

Wholesale distributors have a responsibility to support within reason, parts for the equipment they choose to sell.

If you are buying product from someone that has to order it in, ask yourself if their committed.

As a contractor, do you rent your van and tools every time you get an install job? Of course not you made the investment in your business to perform your service with required tools at hand.

Everyone has had a DOA equipment install at least once. We all know that the manufacturer for the most part won’t take a unit back at par. Wouldn’t behoove the wholesaler to have that potential spare part on hand than to have a used piece of equipment back in their warehouse or a lost contractor customer because he is stuck with junk?

Dan (the guy who started ihateviessmann.com)

MPF: My contractor currently has 28 Viessmann systems installed; mine was around the 20th he'd done. When building the house, I specified that I wanted hydronic heat. The contractor suggested Viessmann. I researched systems, and agreed to his decision. I did question his expertise, saw systems he'd previously installed, and did ask about his maintaining common repair parts on hand. For the umpteenth time, he'd never had a gas valve fail, hence didn't have one on-hand. He has also requested of Viessmann several times that they offer contractors (through their distributors) a "suitcase" assortment of most common repair parts based on Viessmann's repair and replacement experience. None is offered.

Unknown

LOL...

"For the umpteenth time, he'd never had a gas valve fail, hence didn't have one on-hand"

For the umpteenth time, that's no excuse or at least a poor one.

"He has also requested of Viessmann several times that they offer contractors (through their distributors) a "suitcase" assortment of most common repair parts based on Viessmann's repair and replacement experience. None is offered."

He can't make up his own?

You go ahead and feel whatever way you want to, I'll make sure I have the right parts on the shelf or they are readily available so MY customers are covered.

gary_6

Couldn't agree more. If you're gonna be installing the unit and this is the product line you're going to be pushing to your customers, it makes sense to have spare parts available.

I guess commen sense died a long time ago.

Mark Hunt_5

MPF

You really won some fans with that post. I can tell it was from the heart too.

Unknown

Thanks,

Figuring I should practice what I preach I called my supplier on those fancy Italian HPs. He says, "Yes I have everything but it's all generic stuff anyways." Don't that give you the warm fuzzies?

Derheatmeister

MPF,Italian HP never heard of this Company? HM.

Unknown

Fancy Italian Heatpump...

I've already bored most of these guys to tears with it but:

www.robur.com

There is a US site, click on the US flag lower right.

Gas Absorption Heat Pump. Various products. I installed 2 GAHP-AR here in CT. I may see some case studies soon. So I hear.

Assembled in Italy with parts from the US that were probably assembled in Mexico.

I met the engineers at ASHREX in NYC. Smart people. Very receptive to even the craziest of my ideas. LOL...

This link will take you right there:

http://www.robur.com/us/pag_risultati_comparativa.jsp?idc=6&idl=5

What you REALLY want to do is walk into Viessmann's showroom in Warwick with your clients and tell Viessmann about 1/2 way through the tour that you're interested in a lot of their products but might not be using a Viessmann boiler. That'll get the feathers flyin'!! Hee heeeee...

Kelly_3

Constantin

If Viessmann are so freaking great and you only own one, why do you have to contact them so freaking much? Did they sell you a lemon? Shouldn't your install been cut and dry? How many problems have you really had, please come clean!

Constantin

Huh?

When it comes to tech support, I've only made calls for two issues that I can remember.

1) Called them up to get two Vitosol tubes replaced that had been damaged in shipping. Not Viessmanns fault and the replacements were here in less than a week (came from England via Canada, IIRC).

2) Called Warwick once when Ed was over to service the boiler (this was his first Vitola / Viessmann) and tech support walked him through part of the procedure. I subsequently called to inquire about local supply houses that I could order replacement parts at, if I or my Ed needed them.

Doesn't seem too excessive. Perhaps that's why I have been happy with the company and the support they have provided. Lastly, how about posting under a real name and e-mail address? That, and the tone of your post, unfortunately seems to imply that you have an agenda.

Rob Blair

Sorry but ...

I couldn't help posting just to take the count up to 100!!!

Rob

mtfallsmikey

Time for .02 from The Geezer

My, how times have changed..My old "suitcase": RA117, RA832,R8184,L4064, right/left Sunstrand "J" pumps, shaft couplings, burner motors, 1/3 hp blower motor, some belts, nozzles, couple of universal Honeywell gas valves,thermocouples, nozzles,electrodes, Dongan Multi-Former, even an old Detroit Lubricator strap-on high limit control for the "special" occasions. Very few customers went without heat,not many that I couldn't make run.

Bob Bona_4

don't

forget the Lennox sewing machine pump belt

gary_6

mtfallsmikey

But look at all the money he's saving by having this state of the art boiler that you must get parts Fed ex'ed in and many techs have difficulty working on it.


Just disregard the 600 bucks for the gas valve, 200 in fire wood, 100 in space heaters.

AND 130 hours with No Heat.

Heaven Forbid if the ignition system goes.... Whoops there goes another 600 out the window and several days without heat.

mtfallsmikey

Forgive me, Bob!

Didn't mess with too many Lennox's til the later years...they were in almost every home in the Front Royal / Strasburg Va. area at one time..and I did keep a belt for those. They were like the Thermo-Pride brand, built like a tank! IMHO, one of the smoothest running quiet scorched air furnaces ever made.

Derheatmeister

Mtfallsmikey, Your "Service Suitcase with:RA117, RA832,R8184,L4064, right/left Sunstrand "J" pumps, shaft couplings, burner motors, 1/3 hp blower motor, some belts, nozzles, couple of universal Honeywell gas valves,thermocouples, nozzles,electrodes, Dongan Multi-Former, even an old Detroit Lubricator strap-on high limit control for the "special" occasions. MAY need a upgrade if you "Don't want to fade away". Or do you think that if you take a "386"/Commodore Computer in of repair some one would actually fix it.BTW do not get rid of those parts, I've got some of those to. Good to have....Just pick a line and try to stick with it..Everything is getting specialized/More Expensive i know.. HM.

GLENN_14

THE BLAME GAME CONTINUES

I have been reading this thread with some amusement. It is something to see the "blame game" going on here. So many of you want to buy direct insted of dealing with the Wholesalers and you question what value they add. First you should try and contact the average manufacturer. Can you get someone??? Now try this with all contractors calling direct. The result?? No one getting anything done. What value does the wholesaler add to the product lines??? Training on the products they support, Tech help for the products they support, and yes parts inventory for the products they suppport. If the wholesaler is refusing to stock parts then you should get after them to get their inventories in order. If you are dealing with this wholesaler because their price is the lowest then welcome to the world of "walmart" wholesalers. You can't have it all. Lowest prices, best quality and best service. You will always get only two out of three. So pick what you want. The homeoner who started this has every right to be upset over the dilema they were placed in. I wonder if the wholesaler and manufacturer have shown this to their "people" to act as a training exercise for how "NOT" to take care of their customers in the future?

Timco

All I know is that when I needed a controller for a top end Mestek boiler that was going into lockout (NOT a no-heat situation, cust could reset boiler) Mestek sent me the controller DIRECT to my house, no BS, PO's or mark-ups via supply houses. (part was still under warranty) Must have a different policy...

Tim