Goodman furnace flame flutters then turns off with constant clicking
I've been having an issues with a Goodman (GMES96) furnace. When turning on, the flame keeps fluttering with the pressure switch or control board making constant clicking noises. If it ends up igniting, the flame goes out when the blower turns on, and then it has issues again igniting the flame.
If the flame stays on, it'll eventually cut out and the blower will keep running without any flames. HVAC technician has already replaced the inducer motor, pressure switches, and the control board with nothing solving the issue. I also did attempt to fix the 90 elbow flue that I've heard causes issues.
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You need a new technician who can find the problem. Shooting the parts cannon at the furnace will end in a disaster. Sounds like you may have loose or corroded wiring or a bad ground.
The symptoms you have could have many causes.
Post your location we may know someone who can help.
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North Shore Massachusetts, in Woburn.
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You may have a cracked heat exchanger. If it is out of warranty then that means a new furnace, If it is in warranty, That means that you pay someone to take the heater completely apart to replace the heat exchanger then put it all back together again. That ain't cheap either.
If you don't have a cracked heat exchanger, Lucky you! but the flame sensor will need attention. That could be a simple cleaning of the electrode or a replacement control and half a dozen other things that cost somewhere between the two. I have tested flame sensor controls by using a propane soldering torch held at the flame sensor to see it the problem goes away, then I know the controls are good and need to look elsewhere. If the problem does not go away with a steady flame on the flame sensor, then I go in the other direction.
EDIT: I'm not recommending that propane torch test to a DIY. Only a short cut to the pro that understands how flame rectification works.
Edward Young Retired
After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?
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the flame going out when the blower turns on is the classic sign of a compromised heat exchanger. with it burning weird before that I would be surprised if it was something else, especially if it is power vent.
fluttering flame without the going out when the blower starts would point to gas pressure problems, especially if it is propane but it sure sounds like a bad hx with it reliably going out when the blower starts.
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I've called three separate techs and none of them can determine root cause. Wouldn't shock me if the heat exchanger is compromised. The system is only 5 years old… this is so frustrating! We had issues with a damp basement when we moved in, so I wouldn't be surprised if the moisture started messing with the internal parts.
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did any of them inspect the hx?
there are 2 other methods, you can direct a fog machine in to the combustion side and see if you see it on the blower side or yo can have one person put a little container of wintergreen in the combustion side and see if another person smell it in the house.
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It would be unusual for a HX to fail in 5 years but anything is possible.
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it would be unusual for anything else to cause the flame to go out when the blower starts. about the only other thing that could cause that would be a power problem somewhere in the low energy or line voltage circuits that causes the voltage to drop when the motor starts or the relay for the motor closes.
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or a piece of foil insulation or something that is flapping around and shorting something out when the blower starts
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One technician did open up the secondary HX and told me it appears fine. I have now a fourth separate technician coming tomorrow and will see if he can evaluate the HX.
A few other weird things: Two weeks ago, the system shut off overnight and tripped the breaker. We flipped it back, plugged the furnace back in and then eventually it threw a reversed 115 VAC Polarity error code. The technician wasn't able to replicate the code again. After running a few tests with a manometer, the tech told me they would have to replace the control board and pressure switches. That still didn't fix the issue.
I called two different technicians and both have been stumped since. I called the original installed who swapped out many of the parts without charge (natural gas valve, pressure switches, control board, inducer motor, condensation trap), fixed the sloping out of the exhaust, and none of that fixed it. Most recently, I turned on the system to see how it was behaving and it looked like at start-up, it was experiencing some negative air pressure or something. As it tried to ignite, I could see the front panel and sides of the unit suck into the unit… I wonder if that's a sign of the issue(s). I don't believe there's any blockage in the intake, though I'll have the tech check that out tomorrow too.
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what do you mean by this:
"front panel and sides of the unit suck into the unit"?also look at the voltage of both legs of your power service somewhere inside the house and at the furnace and look at it at the furnace as it tries to start. the tripping a breaker might be a burned up connection somewhere in the wiring to it that is both causing low voltage and shorting to ground or neutral.
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A bit hard to describe, but focusing on the furnace cover I circled and then side panel where I drew an arrow. I guess envision the act of breathing: The furnace cover looked like it was pressing into unit as if it wasn't tightly bolted in, I have it bolted on pretty tight. And then a tiny section in the side panel flexed a little—imagine bending inward—into the unit and then 'popped' back out in a split second.
Two of the technicians did do some voltage checks with a multimeter/tester and didn't see anything out of the ordinary. I saw one testing it at the gas valve and then I think the pressure switches. But, I will mention the wiring to the new tech tomorrow to see if he can diagnose that.
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is the combustion air piped directly in to the burner or is it open to the inside of the cabinet and the burner is sucking from inside the cabinet?
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It's the latter, the outside air intake pipe comes into the top and is open to the inside of the cabinet.
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Maybe I missed it but was the intake pipe checked for blockage? Did you try running it with the cover off the burner?
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i kind of assumed that one would have checked that the vent pipes were clear before replacing pressure switches and control boards but maybe that was too much of an assumption
(and that was going to be my next question if it was the dump in to the cabinet design)
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if the combustion air pipe is plugged and it is using the inside of the cabinet for the um…combustion air plenum, there is likely some leakage of the system air in to the cabinet so i could see how that would change the operating conditions when the blower starts.
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"reversed 115 VAC Polarity error code" I would want to verify the polarity of the receptacle that the furnace is plugged into. Available at Home Depot. (Electrical Polarity Tester)
If the polarity at the receptacle is ok, it's possible that the wiring of the power cord connection in the furnace j-box is reversed.
PS. You are not supposed to have a gas union in the furnace cabinet.
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Has anyone checked to make sure you are not drawing products of combustion back into the intake vent? I'm speaking of this happening outside of course. I have seen what you are describing with the cabinet sucking in and every time it is due to recirculating flue gases.
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Tech blew out the intake and there was no blockage. Running it with cover off does help slightly, but system still cycles on and off with the pressure switch.
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