Maneuvering boilers on tight staircases

Unknown

This can't be a unique situation on Long Island , can it ? We replaced this Aldrich Heat Pack yesterday .

Unknown

Why , oh why

would anyone build a staircase that ends so close to a wall ? I wonder what goes through a designers mind - like how to get furniture down , or maybe a boiler . Maybe 3 out of 4 homes with the basement staircase in the middle of the house are just like this one . There was 25 inches from the stair to the wall .

Unknown

Kenny and Danny

carried the water tank down by hand . When we handtrucked the V83 to the bottom , it got wedged in there . We had to tumble it off the platform . George stopped by to help us muscle the Aldrich out of there . The 2nd pic shows how tight the lift was . Best part of the day was the homeowner asking if we could move the aquabooster closer to the boiler - after the job was up and running .

Mike T., Swampeast MO

Why?

Basement staircases frequently "evolve". Just like modern suburban "planning" things just happen and nobody is really concerned in the beginning.

Will post photos of the basement staircase I'm currently building. To avoid just that kind of problem at the bottom where the old gravity mains force me to place a wall to avoid an awful head banging, I've turned the bottom 90 degrees without increasing width. Instead of the standard three-step quarter-turn winder, the last five steps "dance".

9 23/32" normal run with 7 1/32" rise replace the original steps that were 8" run, 8" rise. Completely traditional construction. A fun challenge.

todd s

Nice Job Ron

Just curious, whu an aquabooster instead of an indirect?

Robert O'Connor_7

Ron Jr.

Just hadda laugh! Have we ever, "Been there,and Done that".

Nice work, as usual!

Ron, How did you ever make out with the DH situation?

Robert O'Connor/NJ

lchmb

per the norm

You do some of the neatest install's in the worst locations...:) But again come out shining!! That staircase look's like it was fun..NOT... I think we should make the carpenter come in and help bring the boiler's in and out..That'll teach em..LOL

jeff_51

why does????

Ron Jr always get stuck with all the crap jobs??? Just lucky??? Don't you love the ones where they build a (room) around the boiler with no access to the front of the boiler and you have to remove the water heater and softner before you can even get to the boiler and then you have to pcik up all the kids toys and misc junk that has been (stored) in the basement for the last twenty years. Oh, they always tell you it will be all moved out of the way when you come (an 18 inch wide path through the junk) and then of course the floor drain is plugged cause it hasn,t been cleaned in forty years or uncle Jon was doing some work and washed out a bucket with a little sakrete in it and it hasn't drained right ever since. And then they wonder why it costs so much. Oh well, we'll all see John Paul whebn we die. (And I ain't even catholic)

Weezbo

*~/:)... Good work

now did the HO start whining about the wood panelling he imported from LU An )) on the move it over a bit ,"Ok, heres my pencil draw it on the ground " ))sorry ...my dad would direct a size nine for clairification...:)

Unknown

Not sure

why they went with an aquabooster . Price might be the deciding factor . The premature failure of some brands of indirects we use could be another . My neighbor is on his 4th Phase 3 in 5 years .

On the flip side , we have no service problems with aquaboosters for 10 years or better , as long as they're connected to a new boiler and coil . Thanks Todd .

Unknown

The homeowner had alot

of construction being done on the 1st floor . From the looks of the finished part of the basement , I think that was their next project . Hell , it sure beats trying to finish a basement with an old clunker sitting next to the new boiler . That was our other option if it didn't fit up the stairs . Thanks Weezbo .

Unknown

Good question

Forgot all about that " situation " . I'll ask about that job tomorrow . Thanks alot Robert .

Unknown

You can't believe

how many homes are like this over here . I can understand that the staircase has to fit into the 1st floor plan , as well as the 2nd floor , but this is ridiculous . Funny thing is Kenny changed the 275 oil tank in the basement a few weeks ago . They pulled out a few ballisters to roll the tank off the stairs , I still can't believe they got it down . Thanks again Lchmb .

Unknown

There's plenty of crap jobs

to go around over here , I'm just one of the few who post pics of them . I know what you mean about access and clutter , we see it every day . We were installing some baseboard today and there was zero room to move . It makes a good 8 hour job a 2 day nightmare . Thanks Jeff .

Unknown

You're on to something

I wonder if these staircases are put together as an afterthought - after the layout of the 1st floor is all on paper . I guess it was a different mindset in the 40s and 50s when most of the L.I. homes were built . Everyone thought of them as cellars , and who would finish off a cellar ?

jeff_51

we love thje pics ron

I think there are about a thousand guys on this site that would give you a job in a minute if you ever wanted to move

Constantin

You do it again!

Congrats on another education in the realities of getting boilers into locations where most people would start pulling the 15 lb sledge to make an access hole!

The install looks great and the maintenance guy will love you for the access that the spacing between the boiler and the water heater is going to give him.

I love the clean lines and the usual attention to detail. Thanks for sharing!

ScottMP

Ron

Do you guys have to instrall a Vacum Breaker on the HWH ?

What happened to the IFC taco's.

Neat job as always.

Scott

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

John R. Hall

Homeowner checklist

It makes me wonder if there are contractors who send a homeowner "checklist" out when pricing a job, explaining to them how they should prepare the area for a changeout. It could save a big headache later on. (No, I'm not suggesting they knock out a wall, just clearing the area and making everything accessible.)

Bob Harper

think out of the box

Don't kill yourselves putting up with impossible conditions you didn't create!

Tell the homeowner as part of the deal, he will need a carpenter to demo those illegal, non-code compliant stairs and re-configure them. Have them come down to a large landing, turn 90, then out onto the floor. This is what many of these older homes had originally then some genius remodeled as seen above. I love these when they add a bedroom--no second means of egrees, nothing to indicate to the fire dept. someone lives down there and try to drag that sucker up out of there on a stretcher( I'm a retired paramedic).

Other options may include taking a Sawzall or torch to the clunker to take it out in pieces, opening a window well, or talking them into installing a Bilco door with stairs to the outside, which is really sweet not having to tromp through the house.

Of course, the down side is you're afraid the cost of all this will scare them off. I learned there are plenty of fish in the sea. If money is tight, you may get him to do the carpentry himself. Your backs and your sanity aren't worth one install.

Side note: I use a 5FT. magnesium appliance trucks from Wesco. It has the strap and the stair creepers and works well in tight quarters. However, when negotiating stairs, the boiler can sometimes lift off the baseplate of the truck. There are plenty of rails to strap it down vertically to the truck with. In the pic, I would attach roped to the truck axle and put a gorilla upstairs while someone small and strong got underneath. You may need a 2x4 as a lever to pry it up. Once you get it going a few steps, you should be ok.
HTH,

Steve P.

Tight turn

Powered appliance carts do wonders in these situations. You are able to run the wheels up out of the way to gain several inches. By moving wheels up and putting a small piece of cardboard under the cart lip you can spin the cart and boiler very easily. One man can move heavy boilers up and down stairs with very little effort.

[Deleted User]

aquabooster

Just a quick question , whats an aquabooster ? Been in the trade for a long time & never heard the term . Mabe it's something i'm familiar with by another name?????? Thanks Jack

Mark Eatherton1

Sit-n-Spin...

One of our suppliers (Low Energy Systems) has a small plate that has a large diameter roller bearing assembly on it, similar to a lazy susan. Once they get down to the lower landing, they set the sit n spin on the deck, lower the boiler and dollie (trombone style stair climber) on it, and spin it 90 degrees. Of course, there has to be adequate space on the bottom landing to accomodate the turning radius of the box as a whole, which in your case doesn't appear to be the case...

You'd love these guys Ron,, we tell them where the boiler needs to go, and they deliver it to the SPOT. I've seen them wrestle boilers through basement windows, and attic windows before. Great bunch of people to work with.

Great work again for your crew and yourself. Sure you don't want to come and work the graveyard shift here on Colorado? ;-)

We have GREAT sunrises...

Dale

Great Job Ron

Does the aquabooster have an inner coil? Or,does the domestic water coming into the coil in the boiler and then the booster? More important, how is your home remodel job coming on? Maybe I missed the pics.

Unknown

We also call them

water banks . It's just an electric water heater , without the electric . A bronze pump circulates water through the boiler's coil and the water heater stores it .

Unknown

Thanks again Constantin

I left room between the 2 units for the reason you mentioned . I love it when the homeowner is in a rush to get out of there , then returns and aint happy with the configuration . She had a short memory , cause I remeber the old boiler taking up more space than the new boiler and heater . Hey Constantin , are you going to Brookhaven a day early ? I won't be able to go to the seminar , but I'm definitely going to the night before get together .

Unknown

The latter

We used the boiler coil to make the hot water .

Hey , thanks for asking about the remodel . I tried to pipe some radiant in the walls , but it squooshed the insulation too much . A better choice woulda been some type of radiant track , but that's when it gets too involved . My next choice is all perimeter baseboard on outdoor reset , with radiant in the bathroom floor alone . It should work out nice , I hope . I'm finishing up the new kitchen this spring , I'll take pics when it's dne - it's a horror show in there right now .

Unknown

I wish it was that easy


We normally won't even think about cancelling a job like this . There's always a way to get the new stuff down - a few years ago we split a Weil WTGO 5 section to be passed down into a cellar with no stairs . The problem comes with removing the old unit . And as I get older and my back gets weaker , I have no qualms leaving a boiler like that down in the basement . Thanks alot for the advise Bob . We got the best system for yanking these things out - young help .

Constantin

Excellent!

I look forward then to meeting you! Most likely, I will be coming down from the North and will try to catch a Ferry across the sound... I hope the weather is good!

All the best until then!

Unknown

Steve , we have a Powermate

and it does work wonders with heavy loads . I think on that day another crew was using it , so we were skunked .

Once we got the boiler on the 1st step past the landing , the rest were pretty easy using the regular hand truck . Thanks for the heads up Steve .

Unknown

I like that lazy susan idea

We have something similar for the jobs where we have to drop a Tall York boiler and pull it out from under the stairs - without cutting the back wall out .

I also like the idea of suppliers bringing the new equipment into the boiler room . Is that all part of the deal when you buy from that supply house ? Is there an extra charge ? The most we can get is curbside dropoff for the commercial sized stuff .

Don't keep tempting me Mark , one day I'll take you up on that offer . I hear you're living like a King up in the mountains . Word is you drive a Humvee to work and a Ferrari for " errands " . Thank you very much Mark for the kind words .

Unknown

No vacuum breaker

Matter of fact , I've never seen one installed on a heater around here . I'm starting to see them here and there on sprinkler systems , when they do the connections in the basement .

The IFCs are still a sore issue . For some reason we can only get 6 at a clip . And they go fast . Something I'd like to try is the flowcheck/valve/flange . If our supplier gets around to stocking them , I bet it'll translate to us getting 6 at a clip ............

Thanks alot Scott .

Marty_3

Stairclimber

Ron, we use an ElectroTruck stair climber but it wouldn't be any use on those stairs once you get to the landing. I'm thinking of installing an aquaboost from the domestic coil on my boiler and using a bronze circ. but my question is: how do you control the circ? Can't really tell by looking at your pics. Nice job.