Was I taken advantage of ?

jbplumber

Plumbing ,Heating, Dealer.

Weezbo

HEP

Heating Electrical Plumbing. remember in the late 50's and 60's He's hep? peh Purple Elephant Hair *~/:)

Mad Dog

Why put it back ?

There is nothing wrong with it, new boilers come with standing pilot all the time - we specify them that way. Spark ignition is ok, but the components don't hold up that long and are very expensive. Maybe the dude didn't have exactly the parts he needed but he got them heat. Your not implying that standing pilot systems are dangerous are you? We've done that sometimes. Monday Morning quaterbacking is great, but from what I read the man got them heat and its working fine. Boy, I'd be terribly p.o.'d if I were that serviceman and company. No good deed goes unpunished!!!!I don't know where that job was but I can teel you Long Island over the weekend was very similar. We had people calling all weekend long with freezeups and no heats. They were saying the same things....no body will answer the phones nobody will come.....thank you so much. As far as I'm concerned, the guy got what he paid for, and that doesn't sound out of whach either. We probably would have gotten a little more. Mad Dog

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Mad Dog

I agree with you Steve

but after seeing what that guy posted and working around the clock all weekend I couldn't help but commiserate with the service and the company. But that would have been very funny....gets let it wither in the vine. Mad Dog

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Constantin

Allow me to quibble...

If, as Tim alleges, the substitution of a standing pilot flame vs. ignition module is not legal, then the smart thing for the tech would have been to put in the standing flame ignitor until the proper part became available.

I always err on the side of cautious when it comes to being exposed to wild levels of liability that could break the back of my company, household, whatever. As you suggest, the substitution of a standing flame pilot may be perfectly safe and practiced widely in the field.

Yet, all that does not matter if you end up in court and you can't show that the manufacturer of the boiler deemed it OK to have their specified ignition module substituted by another make and model. The court may still give you the benefit of the doubt, but why take the chance?

Jeff_17

CAVEAT EMPTOR

In buying my home 7 years ago, it came with a steam system....not too old, but old enough! One COLD weekend, I could not get any heat...just VERY intermittently...checked the water, checked the millivolt gas valve, and checked for faulty therm....called in a "heating" guy that was PAGED to my house...he adjusted the steam pressure to cut in at 2.5 psi and out at about 6...then told me...I would need a whole NEW steam sytem. Boiler looked "too small" to heat a "large old victorian" And "the pressure was way too LOW! " Luckily, I wrote to the Wetheads here..got some serious info on steam systems and realized I needed a $1.25 part called a NEW pigtail. Dan said not even to bother cleaning the old one....I installed it myself, cranked the pressure back down...and the girl has worked wonderfully ever since! Heats that 3-floored Victorian wonderfully, even on the coldest day of the year! A far cry from what this "heating"guy told me it would cost to install a new boiler. It pays to learn, research, and find out things they "don't teach you in college." I bought two of Dan's steam heating books and know more than a lot of newbies in the field thanks to Holohan, Steamhead, Mad Dog, and others I neglect ot mention.

Like we learned in Latin class...."CAVEAT EMPTOR"

DanHolohan

Beware

the Knucklehead.

Rudy

Everyone here is missing the point. Some are even getting defensive.

The question is, was I taken for a ride? (no comment here)

Another good question is, why was this the only guy available when everyone else was busy?

John R. Hall

Feelin' beat up John?

I'm glad you posted here John. A lively and frank discussion benefits all -- that's one of the keys to the Wall's success. I hope you have a better understanding of the heating trade now and take that knowledge back to the "outside world." This has certainly provided some good fodder for this journalist.

Stay warm.

Mad Dog

I understand ALL the ramifications Timmie

But as Tony the Tiger from your other post said, these are on out of warranty boilers. He also said, that you may be a little touchy about the subject as you testisfy on it. I hear ya loud and clear. Your's is the totally safe, never deviate from the rules approach, which is great, But it would have left John's family freezing that night with damage likely to the house. Also, you know as well as I that is when people open their ovens and use kerosene and electric heaters in desperation. I'll guarantee you that many more peolpe die form those situations than a competant tech who converted to a standing pilot. Maybe you guys who like to have the tech arrested and put on trial. Thsi really has gotten ridiculous. With Respect, Mad Dog

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Rock2

Service Contract

During the heating off season it is wise to lock yourself into a service contract with a reputable firm, check them out call some of their clients, word of mouth is always a key rather than the biggest yellow page ad. Also have someone on stand by, better to be proactive than reactive.Good Luck.

eleft_4

PMe Mag

Dan,
Nice article on smart people.

50%..80%?

al

Mad Dog

Busy??????? let's see......Saturday afternoon/evening

The blizzard is in full swing...single digits.....Playoffs are on....the beer is going down nicely...fires roaring away....just about every other plumbing outfit in my area was not only closed, but the answering machines were off and the pagers in the truck. We did alot of calls last weekend freezeups,,,no heats,,,et cetera. ,,and people were telling us they couldn't get ANYBODY. I talked to alot of these contractors on monday and they said I was crazy to be going out in that weather AND with all the games on. Don't hold it against the companies and men that ARE willing to go out when nobody else will - some of us are actually available for our customers AND new customers 24/7. Everyone we serviced knew upfront they were paying a premium , but made the choice and were very satisfied. One lady when she first called, when informed of the minimum said: "well.....I guess I don't have a choice!!!!" Our secretary politely quipped: " oh yes you do...you can wait till monday, try getting someone else, or go to a relatives house...." She called back 10 minutes later....: " your not kidding, we can't get anyone...when can you come?" Lady was very grateful that I could thaw out her pipes, and the charge did not even go over the minimum charge. Yeah, guys were busy alright...watching sports drinking beer and debating who would go to the superbowl. I guess some of us need the money more than others. Besides, I get a special thrill out of being the only one in my area that will put the trucks on the road in ANY weather. Mad Dog

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Cliff Brady

Warping of Supply and Demand

The service company was upfront about the minimum charge for an emergency service call, but not about the emergency rates that may apply. It sounds like the tech made an on the spot decision to go for as much as cash as he thought he could get while in the door with the parts on the truck. This does not seem to be the kind of behavior that the Wallies I have come to know here would condone.

I know a service company needs to bring in $150 - $200 an hour to pay expenses and make a living, but the charges do seem excessive. If you want to charge exhorbitant fees due to some temporary warping of supply and demand, please be up front about it, not after the problem is diagnosed.

Regards,

Another proud MBA

Mad Dog

Fair enough Cliff, but alot of assumptions have been made

here. You don't know that he wasn't forewarned before he did it because A) John has taken a walk after posting this, and the tech never got to tell his side of the story. Before we go out on these emergency type calls, people are told the minimum AND a general range of what they could be spending that day. If that is not upfront and fair enough, I don't know what to tell ya. We don't know what happend with John because he is now MIA. Mad Dog...A Proud Artisan

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Steamhead

Thanks, Jeff

glad I could help. Steam heat rules!

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Maine doug_9

So John,

you have had 54 responses to your question.

Now what do YOU think is your answer??

jim_14

youre not making many friends here with that MBA crap

The last thing people want to hear is how "educated" you are. When you say "I have an MBA" you sound like a jerk. Its like the lady who told me once "I have 2 PhD's on my wall, Im an educated person".. Well that was true but she had no common sense and made a fool out of herself when shown how simple her "problem" was.

Back to being ripped off:

The question is did the guy charge the right price for the job under the circumstances or did he try to see how much he could get by taking advantage of the situation??

Overcharging someone just because you can get away with is not very professional. Yes charge more if the situation warrants it, but dont get greedy. what goes around come around.

Look at it this way, your driving 5 hours on a family vacation and your water pump goes.. Youre towed to the nearest repair shop.. should that repair now be $600 b/c youre from out of state and on vacation when the normal charge would have been $300 otherwise??

Dont tell me you have a choice-- reality is you have no reasonable choices-you need it fixed

bob_34

nba

former mayor and candidate for governor's husband sold his insurance business at age 60 and fulfilled his lifelong desire to become a plumber. hired on at a mechanical contractor as an apprentice 4 years ago. with so many jobs nowadays requiring people to sit in front of computer screens all day, i consider the plumbing and heating business the best job there is. varied, meet people, solve their problems, move around, get some exercise, learn new stuff every day. this guy knew what many of us know--plumbing and heating is a very desirable lifestyle.