LWCO float style to Probe style

Wcurtis

I am interested in a possible float to probe replacement (nothing wrong, just looking to improve if needed) and it appears Safegard manifold fittings can only be purchased through a distributor.

I have no taps to use for a probe however Safegard manifold/fittings are needed for use with Safegard LWCO

Can these be purchased by an individual?

ethicalpaul

is this it?

Wcurtis

https://www.boilersupplies.com/download/pdf/26595

Wcurtis

Wcurtis

I have inquired through an online form at Boiler Supplies so I’ll see where it lands but initial observation leads me to believe the product is only sold through a business

ethicalpaul

ok is it this?

Maintains water level between two probes. Designed to operate with existing water feeder. Includes manifold, two model EL1214 probes and quick hook-up fittings. Note: The 724 Series is recommended for use on older boilers that do not have tappings suitable for Safgard 400 and CycleGard 400 Series cut-offs.

Wcurtis

I do not have an auto feed feature however if I did this may be close, the part numbers are not matching…should be combination LWCO and manifold Item 711CF

UPDATE

Appears items can be purchased through Boiler Supply, cost of all parts plus shipping is more expensive than a new MM67 through Supply House, guess I can pick my poison and stay with MM67 or upgrade.

Paul

Thanks for your effort

Steamhead

@Wcurtis , the advantage of the Hydrolevel setup is that, unlike the #67, it has zero moving parts. So there is less to go wrong.

EdTheHeaterMan

Your boiler may have a tapping for a probe type LWCO and you may not need a special fitting setup.

You can leave the mechanical LWCO in place and add the probe type to the system

What is the brand & model number of your boiler?

I can't tell from this photo if your boiler has a Probe Type LWCO tapping.

I am afraid to ask what the toggle switch on the Pressure limit is there for? I hope it does not bypass the High Limit for some unknown reason. That would be a real safety Hazard if that is the case.

Wcurtis

HB Smith

before the jacket was insulated I noted at least one tapping but was severely corroded and likely welded closed over time. After purchasing house 5-years ago the basement was very wet and many items on the boiler had corrosion, jacket was added to stop further corrosion until I added a dehumidifer. I have sanded and repainted the door and jacket is next in the spring

The toggle switch has the LWCO an pressuretrol connected to the gas valve acting as an emergency stop

EdTheHeaterMan

👍️

The toggle switch has the LWCO an pressuretrol connected to the gas valve acting as an emergency stop.

Emergency Stop. Good thing! I thought it may have been a bypass to allow the boiler to build up steam pressure for some reason.

When that boiler was manufactured, there were not many probe type LWCO in use. The skim tapping may have been the plug you were looking at. Especially if it was larger that 3/4" Perhaps a summertime job might be to drill out that plug at the water line and tap some 3/4" pipe threads in it. Then the LWCO can be placed directly in the boiler.

If that were in my home, I would leave the #67 in there and do the recommended service each year.

Wcurtis

yes sir that is the plan however I am always looking to improve and a switch to a probe type cut-out began weighing on me somewhat, now that I know more about some of the specifics and of course costs my mind is made up.

Wcurtis

if you zoom in under the bottom left of the LWCO is the plug I was referring to, this is the first photo of the boiler when I moved into the house. Originally thought it could have been an original drain and at some point someone tried to remove it, couldnt and added a smaller one as you can see. I was not about to man-handle the plug and break something.

109A_5

Hello Wcurtis,

I see no real benefit to the expense. The disadvantage of the Hydrolevel setup is it has zero moving parts. It actually has more parts that could fail leaving you unaware of a failure. Would you test it at the same interval as a M&M 67 ? To completely test the system you still have to drain down the boiler to below the probe level.

Also Hydrolevel recommends cleaning the probe every 5 years (residential). So there is still maintenance.

If you have even the slightest mechanical aptitude the M&M 67 is so simple and inexpensive to maintain (if even needed). For me two valves and two cleanings in 50 years. I can't justify the expense of a downgrade to a probe type.

The only way I would even entertain the idea of a probe type is if the M&M 67 housing rotted through or the Sylphon failed.

Just my opinion and I can and do repair electronics. Lets see how many folks this opinion rubs wrong. IMO newer technology is not always better, its usually just throw away and replace stuff.

Oh yeah, if needed I can run my old boiler safely with just a battery, I can't do that with a Hydrolevel (or can you ? Will it run and work correctly on DC power ?).

EdTheHeaterMan

The Plug you are referring to is a front return port. you have one in the rear also. That plug is too low for a LWCO. The probe type LWCO would need a port that is at the minimum water level. which is about 1" to 1-1/2" below the recommended water line. Your mechanical #67 LWCO has a float that breaks the circuit to the burner if the water level gets about 1" to 1/14" below the recommended water line.

When you had all that insulation off you could see a 1" or 3/4" plug in the boiler somewhere at about the water line.  It may have been in the back or the front of the boiler. It is definitely on the front or back section,  never in one of the intermediate sections.  

No use beating a dead horse on this one. You seem to be content with the #67. You know you can add an auto feed with a #67 if you are interested.

Steamhead

I've seen this boiler. There is no tapping for a probe LWCO, since probes did not exist when it was made. It needs either a float-type, or a probe on a manifold.

TKPK

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1829360#Comment_1829360

I have a deep cycle battery and a small inverter that I have run my boiler on for more than a week when power was out in the dead of winter. Intermittent pilot with probe style LWCO. It was my boat battery which was out of the boat for the winter and plugged into a trickle charger before the power went out so no real expense.

Piece of cake

109A_5

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1829796#Comment_1829796

May ways to get it done, I don't even need the inverter. For me, for heat, the simpler the better. I even came up with a circuit to reduce the average thermostat current when running off of a battery. With a car battery in good shape it would probably would run for weeks. Once I ran it for days with two 6 Volt lantern batteries wires in series.

Wcurtis

Could you share how you performed that?

My setup is very simple as well with a thermo pile milivolt gas system and battery backup on the thermostat.

109A_5

Sure Wcurtis, but I think I will put it in a new thread since it is kind or off topic here. An you will get the history and some electrical theory too, why it works.

Neild5

The 0-30 PSI gauge looks like it is on a shut off valve, the low pressure gauge doesn't. The 0-30 gauge should always be on per code, the low pressure valve should have the shut off valve.