System 2000 to Biasi B10 - 4

marinerman

Hello all,

I currently have a 10 year old system 2000 with a majority of the components above the boiler rotting. The design of the manifold setup seems poor and super difficult to work on. Granted, I'm just a home owner. It also seems to run constantly but might be due to older windows.

Quote seen below

Received a quote to replace components above the boiler from a reputable HVAC guy and he immediately said how the system 2000 is crap. Stated how it’s a made of steel and the parts are difficult to come by. He claimed I’m better off replacing the boiler with a Biasi B10-4. He didn’t give me an exact quote for component replacement but gave me $$$ quote for an install with everything from the boiler to the ceiling.

Am I crazy for wanting to swap out a 10yr old boiler? I’m waiting for other quotes but I feel like they will be coming back at $$ to replace just the piping and components. I’ve attached photos for reference. Thank you

Grallert

The EK is a good boiler. Very efficient and forward thinking control scheme. It's unfortunate that so many of them that I have service are jammed into a corner surrounded by screaming hot pipes and a mess of control wiring making them hard to service, not the fault of the boiler. Is a ten year old boiler nearing its service life? depends on who you ask. I would consider getting the near boiler piping neatened up, not only for this boiler but the following boiler. Get a price and a PLAN from anyone offering to do that work.

Oh and mentioning prices is frowned upon here.

Jamie Hall

In my opinion they are both good boilers — but the EK is the better of the two. Unless the boiler itself is actually leaking or failed, I wouldn't replace it — but I would certainly do something about the rat's nest of an installation above and around it, which makes it impossible to keep it clean and serviceable. Find a technician, not a salesman.

HeatingHelp.com

@marinerman Welcome to HeatingHelp! We don't discuss pricing on here so I went ahead and cropped your quote image to exclude the prices and also replaced the prices in your text with $$$ instead. Thanks again and we hope our community helps to answer your questions (which it looks like they have already started to).

EdTheHeaterMan

I believe you have a boiler that is probably the best designed and most efficient use of control logic to offer you the lowest operating cost @marinerman

. that said, your replacement choice, although a great boiler, may offer you a slightly higher operating cost compared to the EK system 2000.

I have been a Buderus Cast Iron boiler installer and a Crown Cast iron boiler installer for most of my career. And I understand your contractor's apprehension to something he does not understand. I was once that guy. But scrapping a System 2000 that is only 10 years old seems like trashing a 2014 Rolls Royce for a Tesla because it is electric, even though it may cost you more to operate the Tesla.

That boiler needs a little TLC to make it look better. The other thing is that you may have one leaking joint that is allowing water to rust all the parts that are just below that leak. Get one leak fixed and you will have a great system that will last you another 10 to 20 years.

The reason I changed my mind about the EK boilers is that during the last few years I was in business, before my health forced my early retirement, I had the opportunity to salvage a 10 year old System 2000 and install it on one of my employee's homes. She did not have the $$$ for a new system and desperately needed it. The preowned system 2000 was well cared for by the original owner who left their family fuel oil business who no longer wanted to heat with oil, they installed a 95+% efficient natural gas boiler.

That boiler is now 22 years old and is well cared for by my son, and he believes there are at least 10 more years left. That pre-owned EK boiler reduced the annual fuel oil cost by 28% in the first year. I remember doing the calculation and adjusting it for actual degree days of use from the previous 2 years of use with the old boiler.

I also remember quoting a new boiler for the neighbor across the street from her, a price for an oil boiler. The LP gas company won the bid and installed a lower price gas boiler. Their actual operating cost went up as a result of the new boiler install as I predicted. The LP gas company had service technicians there several times in that first year to see what was causing the higher fuel cost to no avail.  But I digress.   

Get the system 2000 professional there to do a complete cleaning and tune up with some cosmetic work and you will have your Rolls Royce looking and working like new. 

Perhaps @Roger or @Robertw from EK might be able to guide you to the right repair guy!

marinerman

I apologize for mentioning the price, I was unaware.

Thank you for the insight fellas. My thought is if I spend a couple grand to have the system 2000 tuned up and components redone, it wouldn’t be more beneficial spending and extra 3-4 grand to replace it while it’s torn apart? @EdTheHeaterMan

I think I made an awful decision by giving the contractor a deposit of half the amount already and worried about retracting my decision. He installed a boiler for my step father and it went well so I was confident with him. I thought the price tag seemed fair enough for a full gut and replacement. I am now doubting my decision from the feedback about system 2000’s. I do see the feedback about difficult part replacement but a majority of feedback is positive.

Steamhead

@marinerman , some of EK's people frequent this board. We hope they will chime in. @Roger is one of these, who has been very helpful.

EdTheHeaterMan

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1817086#Comment_1817086

Parts are not difficult to source. Your contractor just needs to call EK. They have everything. They sell direct to the contractor. Not from the manufacturer, to the manufacture rep, to the wholesaler, to the contractor like other boiler manufacturers.

szwedj

Hi @marinerman I would like to address a few things if I could.  First I would just like to say many of the parts on your system are just industry standard items that can be readily obtained from any supply house and the ones that are unique to Energy Kinetics can be purchased by any trade professional, they do not have to be a dealer to buy parts from us.   Also as the manufacturer of the system we are well stocked with all the necessary parts to build these units and part orders will typically ship the same day as ordered.  As a company we celebrated 45 years in business this year and we have many of those original systems still out there running.  But like any piece of equipment, keeping up with maintenance is key to longevity.  Just from looking at the pictures you can see some basic components are leaking and have been for a while and that there are potential draft issues to address.  If it were me and I was dealing with a ten year old system, I would look into getting a price on addressing these issues first.  

I would suggest calling the National Sales Manager, Jay McCay at 908-328-7153 who can refer you to the Territory Manager for your area, who should be able to recommend the dealers in your area to quote making the needed repairs to get your system properly maintained and running again.  I am sure that you will enjoy many more years of quiet and efficient heating with some TLC soon. 

SuperTech

That poor System 2000 just needed the replacement of a inexpensive leaking automatic air vent, that looks like the source of the corrosion. Lack of basic maintenance, what a shame.

At ten years old that boiler has decades of life left in it typically. If you are going to replace it, let me know. I'm willing to travel to pick it up from you. I consider it the best boiler you can get. Some guys don't like it because they don't understand it. We all know how people fear things they don't understand.