Lawn sprinklers

RayH

I recently moved to Florida from Maine and I'm having issues with my pump not shutting off. I had to turn off the breaker to make it stop. Normally the pump will only come on when it's time to water the lawn.
 I changed the 30-50 pressure switch and made sure the expansion tank had 28psi. When I turn the breaker on, the pump will continue running even though the sprinkler control is off. When the pump is running, I have excellent water pressure. Not sure how to get the pump to only come on when it's time to water the lawn?

Brent H.

Is the pump only used for the irrigation system? When you say it keeps running, does the pressure keep increasing or how do you know it’s still running?

RayH

The pump is mounted on the floor in the garage and is only for the irrigation system 

EBEBRATT-Ed

Sounds like it is wired wrong or the pressure switch isn't set right. Do you have a pressure gauge installed near the pressure switch?

EdTheHeaterMan

The switch has a cut in and a cut off pressure. If the pump is constantly running, with no water being used, then the cut out pressure is not getting to the switch. Either the switch is bad or the 1/4" line that connects the switch to the pump is blocked somewhere. Sometimes it is a little speck of rust where the fitting enters the pump. Disconnect the copper tube from the fitting and push a small allen wrench or some other piece of stiff wire in the fitting and see if you can knock off the rust without needing to take anything else apart.

Lyle {pheloa} Carter

I think Ed the heater man has an excellent point. Many times when I find this has happened. At the end of the brass fitting that screws into the cast iron pump body, the tapping has filled in with rust.

RayH

I primed the pump. There was a lot of air in the system. I can now water the lawn manually only. I have a 30-50 switch. The pump is not shutting off because it can't get past 40 psi?

Brent H.

Is there a ball valve on the output of the pump you can close to see if that causes it to stop on pressure?

RayH

No ball valve. There is a hose bib outside of the garage from the well pump

neilc

what about a backflow protector? they usually have valving,
is the pump discharge all visible from the garage to outside?
and you could hang a hose end pressure gage at that hose bib , , ,
post a picture or 2, pump, and outside to ground,

Brent H.

Not completely sure about your setup. Do you have zone valves? When the pump is running do the sprinklers run? Most sprinkler controllers have an output to control a pump relay/contactor.

Jamie Hall

RayH said:

I primed the pump. There was a lot of air in the system. I can now water the lawn manually only. I have a 30-50 switch. The pump is not shutting off because it can't get past 40 psi?

Most likely. Unless you have very few sprinklers there is a lot of flow, so the pump is well down its flow curve. I'm not sure, in a sprinkler application, why you would even want the pump to shut off on pressure, since that would stop the flow unless you also have a pressure tank on the system -- and I'm not sure why you'd have that.

Explain?

hot_rod

With all the sprinklers off the pump runs? A leak, , bad pressure switch, or the pump isn’t sized to reach 40 psi
Got a manual, it will show max pressure the pump is capable of

PRR

RayH said:

...The pump is not shutting off because it can't get past 40 psi?

My half-horse well-pump won't fill two RainBird sprinklers. It runs steady and only dribbles 15psi. To get any throw I have to run just one sprinkler. Even then it just does 25psi forever. This seems normal to me. Like filling teenagers on a limited food budget.

RayH

Originally the entire system worked fine for years. Initial problem was with the pump not stopping after all zones were completely watered. First thing I did was change the pressure switch and clear the 1/4" tube from the pump to the switch. The pump takes longer than normal to get up to 40 psi and continues to run but never gets to 50psi

Jamie Hall

And it never will, unless something out there is stopping the flow. It occurs to me, however, that if there is some sort of device or timer or what have you that is stopping the flow to the sprinklers, but the pump never shuts off... where is the water going? Do you have a nice leak somewhere?

Intplm.

@RayH
Often when you have an irrigation system pump dedicated to the irrigation system, there is a pump start relay in line with the pump. Might need to look to that?
Do you have a Hunter or Rain Bird System.
Often its best to stay with the same brand.

In Florida they also use drive points when they dig or drive there wells.
Do you have those lovely brown stains or is this city water?
If a well and from what I have gleaned from this post you are continually clogging or partially clogging the pressure switch.
Depending on how good the recovery is on your well I would run the water as long as you can until it clears to help prevent the switch from fouling.

Intplm.

RayH said:

Originally the entire system worked fine for years. Initial problem was with the pump not stopping after all zones were completely watered. First thing I did was change the pressure switch and clear the 1/4" tube from the pump to the switch. The pump takes longer than normal to get up to 40 psi and continues to run but never gets to 50psi

In reading this again, I think your well point might be clogged.

If you can take a hose and send city water pressure down the suction line you might clear it.

EdTheHeaterMan

See if I got this right.

1. You have a well with a pump.
2. The pump is connected to a well-x-trol® or some other tank set at 28 PSI with no water pressure in the tank
3. The pump used to shut off when all the sprinklers were turned off by the respective valves.
4. Recently the pump stopped shutting off because the pump no longer makes 50 PSI

If those are the facts, then that should eliminate several of the suggestions (including my suggestion above) and we need to focus on why the pump is no longer making higher pressure.

Well point is clogged
Well pump impeller blades are failing
Well pump impeller blades are covered with debris
There is a leak internally in the well pump seal allowing the pressure water to get back to the inlet side of the pump.
The inlet to the pump is clogged.

Intplm.

Venturi tube inside the pump head could also have debris in it.

RayH

The water is high with iron. I need to clear the suction line without digging it up 

Intplm.

RayH said:

The water is high with iron. I need to clear the suction line without digging it up 

Ah yes, so you do have the stain thing happening since it's high with iron. A typical well for irrigation in Fla.

If you can get higher pressured water down that suction pipe as I have mentioned above, it could help.

Do it by taking water from the house.


Install a fitting on the suction line that you can attach a garden hose to from the house to the well.



From those two points, attach the garden hose.


Run the water from the house down the suction line.

After some time turn a zone on while the water is running to clear it out as much as possible. Then and only then shut things off.

The only thing you can do is keep working the problem.
If you get it running again, I would consider installing a filter somewhere to hopefully stop this from continuing.

RayH

I have connected the domestic water to the irrigation system. So this should flush the well point. The filter sounds like a great idea to keep the pressure switch from getting fouled. How do I prevent the well point from getting fouled?

Jamie Hall

RayH said:

I have connected the domestic water to the irrigation system. So this should flush the well point. The filter sounds like a great idea to keep the pressure switch from getting fouled. How do I prevent the well point from getting fouled?

Well point? Good question. You can't. The best you can do is backwash it from time to time. On big wells we surge them by fitting a piston into the casing and running it up and down -- but that won't ork on a well point.

Now. That said. You will likely be tempted to backwash the well with your domestic (city?) water, since it has nice high pressure. If you are so tempted, you must be aware of two things: first, on whatever connection you have to do this, you must have a reduced pressure zone backflow preventer -- not just a check valve -- on the connection. This is to protect your health, if nothing else. Second, you might find that your city water supplier will take dramatic exception to this procedure. In many areas such a connection is simply illegal (where I am, for instance) and, if found, the water company will permanently disconnect (as in remove the pipe) your domestic water supply.

Intplm.

Jamie Hall said:

RayH said:

I have connected the domestic water to the irrigation system. So this should flush the well point. The filter sounds like a great idea to keep the pressure switch from getting fouled. How do I prevent the well point from getting fouled?

Well point? Good question. You can't. The best you can do is backwash it from time to time. On big wells we surge them by fitting a piston into the casing and running it up and down -- but that won't ork on a well point.

Now. That said. You will likely be tempted to backwash the well with your domestic (city?) water, since it has nice high pressure. If you are so tempted, you must be aware of two things: first, on whatever connection you have to do this, you must have a reduced pressure zone backflow preventer -- not just a check valve -- on the connection. This is to protect your health, if nothing else. Second, you might find that your city water supplier will take dramatic exception to this procedure. In many areas such a connection is simply illegal (where I am, for instance) and, if found, the water company will permanently disconnect (as in remove the pipe) your domestic water supply.

A very good point.
And you should find that you have back flow prevention/anti siphoning devices already in place.
Look to that as it is very much prevalent in Fla.