Runtal Hydronic Leak Repair?

chewcrew

Forgive me if I posted this in the wrong forum but I'm looking for advice on repairing a brand new 14-foot Runtal hydronic unit that appears to be damaged in shipping. The details:

I ordered three sections from SupplyHouse, which run in a loop along a long stretch of my loft and back to my return. After install, the longest length--the 14 footer-- started leaking near the supply side and was removed and replaced by a temporary length of copper.

The leak appeared to be a pinhole or as though a small section of the fin had separated from the main water-carrying body of the radiator (see image). Upon contacting SupplyHouse I was refunded that money and left with this 14 footer, either to scrap or to sell or (preferrable) repair and re-install.

Not being an expert on this topic, I figure there's some kind of process for repairing, pressurizing away from the main functioning line, and re-installing. If not it's incredibly wasteful and unfortunate to junk this much metal and a (near) perfect, new radiator.

Any thoughts would be appreciated--I'm in the East Bay near Oakland.

HomerJSmith

Post pics from further away and show the pin hole leak. Your photo is not very clear. What model #?

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

Epoxy works well.

hot_rod

Can you cut it shorter and eliminate the damaged part? I'm not sure how the connections are made on the ends.

Could you reach the spot with a MIG welder, wire feed gun?

chewcrew

Thanks so much for having a look -- here are a few videos of the problem as well as some annotated photos I took from screen grabs of the third video. Essentially there is a breach at the point where the square post that intakes from the supply side connects to the flat fin on the top.

I do think I could reach the spot from underneath and just dump a bunch of weld onto it, or try to pack in some epoxy but it's five inches down inside the body of the radiator to reach that spot near the top. I'm not really sure how they weld that point to begin with as it's essentially a thin junction between the rectangular intake post and the long, flat fins that run the length of the radiator.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1TLv_y-NX84Ecg58Bbh3erQVFT5Ctth75/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1eoOOs91guicXVGhRZfs2lEWh5OW-otXt/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1A3wTEDjOGiiAC99NhBM0xsVp041_YqVz/view?usp=sharing

chewcrew

Oh, and this is the model: https://www.supplyhouse.com/Runtal-UF-2-168-9001-14-ft-UF-2-Baseboard-Radiator-Cream-White

hot_rod

If you have experience with welding aluminum with a wire feed, it’s pretty easy to build up a big puddle of molten aluminum for a patch. I’m not sure how you fix the burned finish once you repair the leak?
Maybe epoxy is the best first step.

mattmia2

This is how they are made. there are tanks welded on the ends with bungs welded on for the supply and return connections:
https://www.facebook.com/DiscoveryUK/videos/-european-radiators-how-its-made/2396575607202248/?locale=hi_IN

btw they are steel. runtal supplies them with a little bottle of touch up paint

they essentially spot wend the tank on by passing a current through the bung between the tank and the tube. you might be able to get better access by removing some fins from the back. you could probably solder or braze it as well.

hot_rod

Maybe stick weld it since it is steel. A 3/32 rod on low amp setting may reach in there nicely. A welding shop may be worth a visit?

realliveplumber

If it was damaged in shipping file a claim with the shipper. If its a factory defect send it back.

Is that a flexible faucet connector being used to radiator?

pecmsg

Brand new contact supply house. 

Matt_67

I’d worry about that one. A good welder might be able to seal it up, but it’s not an easy fix. You’d have to clean the paint off, make the weld, then try to make it presentable. If all that’s done and the leak reappears later you have the potential for water damage, especially if it happens when you’re not home.

EBEBRATT-Ed

Why not take it to a sheet metal shop or a welding shop? Or just scrap it and order another one you got your money back.

mattmia2

As a side note supplyhouse.com said they would only ship mine motor freight because UPS had damaged too many.

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

@chewcrew said:

Upon contacting SupplyHouse I was refunded that money and left with this 14 footer, either to scrap or to sell or (preferrable) repair and re-install.

Is that a flexible faucet connector being used to radiator?

Probably a bench test setup.

dko

There is a chart they follow. UPS ground also has size restrictions/limitations.
Anything above 8ft is automatically truck freight.

pecmsg

mattmia2 said:

As a side note supplyhouse.com said they would only ship mine motor freight because UPS had damaged too many.

Then it goes motor freight.

chewcrew

Really appreciate everyone's thoughts. A couple of you have pointed out that I have already been refunded this item--but perhaps due to the cost of shipping Supply House has let me keep it. I do think that the shipper (not UPS, but a custom freight) did not understand the care it would take to protect something of this length and the runtal packaging is not rigid enough to prevent bowing, so I can see if it were held in the middle--as it was--the ends might be distorted enough for the supply side connection to separate from the front blades. Either that, or the supply side bung post was hit during shipping and it was torn loose.

As Matt_67 suggests this is not likely an easy fix. I'm less worried about the cleanliness of the fix as I could just paint over it or put a junction shield on that cosmetically conceals the work. It's just that it's so tight in there I wouldn't be sure how to access.

Matt_67 said:

I’d worry about that one. A good welder might be able to seal it up, but it’s not an easy fix. You’d have to clean the paint off, make the weld, then try to make it presentable. If all that’s done and the leak reappears later you have the potential for water damage, especially if it happens when you’re not home.

HomerJSmith

Look for a welder, whose motto is, "We can weld anything but the crack of dawn and a broken heart."
Get his personal opinion.

chewcrew

Hahahaha LOVE THAT. Thank you!

HomerJSmith said:

Look for a welder, whose motto is, "We can weld anything but the crack of dawn and a broken heart."
Get his personal opinion.

mattmia2

when they shipped mine motor freight it was strapped to a pallet that was longer than it.

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

The last one I purchased was directly from Runtal as it was custom. It was during the pandemic; promised in 6 months, delivered in 8 and the carrier charged $1K freight for an 8' panel.

psb75

Runtal knows how to ship. I got 11-footers on pallets. Fully supported. Freight truck. MA to VT.
Not inexpensive. ( Note: double neg. = a pos. ) But they are good durable radiant heaters. MUCH better than baseboard fin tube.

chewcrew

mattmia2 said:

when they shipped mine motor freight it was strapped to a pallet that was longer than it.

That would have been key! these were just loose in a truck.