Arcoliner low water cut off

HeatingN00b

Hello all. This will be our first year starting our boiler from a summer hibernation. We signed a maintenance contract with the oil company to provide maintenance to the boiler. Upon the season opening cleaning the maintenance guy flush the boiler and cleaned it up. He notice the two things were in need of repairs. The oil primary control (he replaced at no extra charge), and the the low water cut off. He stated that since the boiler is old it will take some time to acquire the part and it will be a separate charge.

Would anyone know the model needed for this boiler?

I have an Arcoliner 1BT K2 series.
The hot water capabilities was removed and now we have a hot water tank 

Jamie Hall

Is this a steam system? Whatever, the low water cutoff is not specific to the boiler, and there are a number of types of low water cutoffs and a number of makers. Can you post a picture of it? And a more general picture of the boiler and its controls?

GGross

Seems strange, low water cutoff is generally an external component that comes from a 3rd party, not boiler specific. Anywhere that sells boilers will no doubt have an appropriate one.

fueloilrich631

Do you have a picture of the LWCO? Is it steam or hydronic? Line voltage or low voltage?

mattmia2

I'd look at what the contract covers, seems strange that the LWCO would be excluded from the service contract. They are quite standard controls, might not be something they have on their truck or keep in their shop but not hard to get.

HeatingN00b

Jamie Hall said:

Is this a steam system? Whatever, the low water cutoff is not specific to the boiler, and there are a number of types of low water cutoffs and a number of makers. Can you post a picture of it? And a more general picture of the boiler and its controls?

Yes this boiler is steam and the hot water portion was removed (the boiler would be in control of heat and hot water). I will post a picture in a few.

HeatingN00b

GGross said:

Seems strange, low water cutoff is generally an external component that comes from a 3rd party, not boiler specific. Anywhere that sells boilers will no doubt have an appropriate one.

Thank you. I think I found what it looks like and I think there are two of them (one for the hot water not in use and the other for the steam ).

HeatingN00b

fueloilrich631 said:

Do you have a picture of the LWCO? Is it steam or hydronic? Line voltage or low voltage?

The boiler is steam. Line voltage or low voltage (that I don't know, is there a way to o know). Pictures coming in a few.
Thank you

HeatingN00b

These are the picture. I think this is the low water cut off. I see two one on the front and the other on the side (the side part was cut off when they installed the hot water heater).

Is this something that I can buy and replace on my own?

neilc

can you post a wide angle shot or 2,
the whole boiler, floor to ceiling,

you're showing a gage and pressuretrol,
your burner,
and what looks like an abandonded domestic coil and its aquastat,

I don't think you've shown a low water cutoff(LWCO),

do you check and service that pigtail(looped pipe under the gage),
it needs to be free breathing into the boiler,
those steel type tend to clog more easily,
your's mounted high on the boiler like that may be less prone,
unscrew that gage, and see that you can blow down into the boiler freely,
clear or replace the piggy if you cannot,
prime the loop with a few oz of water upon reassembly,

where's that LWCO ?

neilc

show the side next to the water heater,
site glass and whatever else, floor to ceiling

EdTheHeaterMan

If I were a betting man, I would guess that you have a McDonald & Miller #67 LWCO that is next to the gauge glass that shows the water level inside the boiler. . If it is really old, then the yellow handle valve would be a black round handle valve.

There might also be a M&M #47-2 LWCO but that one has a water feeder included and it is much more expensive. Either way, If it is clogged with gunk from a few years with proper maintenance, It is a great investment. Don't fool around with it. Even though they are expensive, It is cheaper than the price of a new boiler.

Jamie Hall

That pressure controller belongs in a museum... but that isn't the low water cutoff, not is the aquatat you've pictured.

mattmia2

If you take apart the pigtail, the pressuretrol needs to be installed with the face perpendicular to the curl in the pigtail so as the pigtail moves with temp changes the pressuretrol stays level because it has a mercury switch in it.

EdTheHeaterMan

Still don't see the LWCO, Can you take a picture of the gauge glass on the side of the boiler? That may show you the LWCO

HeatingN00b

neilc said:

can you post a wide angle shot or 2, the whole boiler, floor to ceiling, you're showing a gage and pressuretrol, your burner, and what looks like an abandonded domestic coil and its aquastat, I don't think you've shown a low water cutoff(LWCO), do you check and service that pigtail(looped pipe under the gage), it needs to be free breathing into the boiler, those steel type tend to clog more easily, your's mounted high on the boiler like that may be less prone, unscrew that gage, and see that you can blow down into the boiler freely, clear or replace the piggy if you cannot, prime the loop with a few oz of water upon reassembly, where's that LWCO ?

Yup I am a noob for sure. I will post a picture of the boiler shortly. I found the low water cut off.

In regards the pigtail, I think that was part of the maintenance contract and was service (we will see if the gage move when the boiler is turned on).

Thank you 

HeatingN00b

neilc said:

show the side next to the water heater, site glass and whatever else, floor to ceiling

Yeah I found it. I will post a picture shortly.

HeatingN00b

EdTheHeaterMan said:

If I were a betting man, I would guess that you have a  LWCO that is next to the gauge glass that shows the water level inside the boiler. . If it is really old, then the yellow handle valve would be a black round handle valve. There might also be a M&M #47-2 LWCO but that one has a water feeder included and it is much more expensive. Either way, If it is clogged with gunk from a few years with proper maintenance, It is a great investment. Don't fool around with it. Even though they are expensive, It is cheaper than the price of a new boiler.

Just took a look and found it. Really close, it's a McDonald & Miller #369. I will post shortly a picture. Are 369 expensive and if so can it be repaired or is it worth just replacing it and if so what is a good replacement?

HeatingN00b

Sorry for the late response. The rain gave me hell. Basement had water coming in. Thins is the low water cut off. Its McDonald & Miller #369. Any suggestions what can I replace it with?

HeatingN00b

Just found the part on supply house website.
Wow $580......
Questions 
1. Can I run the boiler without the low water cut off working? If so, I would have to keep track of how much water the boiler has via the water glass right?
2. If do buy the replacement is it something I can replace on my own?

Thank you 

Steamhead

HeatingN00b said:

Just found the part on supply house website.
Wow $XXX

That's the #6667 kit, right? This will be the least expensive option in your case. Anything else would requite much more labor.

And if you don't already have one, you can hook up a water feeder to this unit.

Jamie Hall

NO. You cannot ru the boiler without a functioning low water cutoff

neilc

unless you, or someone you trust your family's, and yours life to, will sit there and monitor that water level while the boiler is turned on,
and by turned on I mean at the service switch, and capable of firing by the thermostat.
If the monitor needs a restroom break, shut off the service switch,
and no setting up a tv and watching a game.
you can also observe that pressure gage, and pressuretrol operation,

If you have to take the chill off the house, don't walk away from it,
fix the LWCO

HeatingN00b

neilc said:

unless you, or someone you trust your family's, and yours life to, will sit there and monitor that water level while the boiler is turned on, and by turned on I mean at the service switch, and capable of firing by the thermostat. If the monitor needs a restroom break, shut off the service switch, and no setting up a tv and watching a game. you can also observe that pressure gage, and pressuretrol operation, If you have to take the chill off the house, don't walk away from it, fix the LWCO

Lol. Time to move little Tommy's bed next to the boiler.

Last year we would run the boiler and check on it every other day and refilled the water to make sure it would stay at the level we was told to keep it at. I don't think last year it was working (first year living in the house) but the home inspection and the boiler inspector never pointed that out untill this year when the boiler was service.

I guess time to order the part and YouTube how to install it.

Thank you 

HeatingN00b

Steamhead said:

Just found the part on supply house website.
Wow $XXX

That's the #6667 kit, right? This will be the least expensive option in your case. Anything else would requite much more labor. And if you don't already have one, you can hook up a water feeder to this unit.

Does not looks like a kit it's just a part.

HeatingN00b

Jamie Hall said:

NO. You cannot ru the boiler without a functioning low water cutoff

It won't run?
I don't think the part was working last winter. The plumber were able to find it bc cause this year we sign a maintenance contract with them. Last winter they said it was too late in the season to sign the contract and they said to just keep the water level at a certain hight.

EBEBRATT-Ed

@HeatingN00b

The low water cutoff is a safety control that shuts the burner off when the water gets too low.

You should NOT run the boiler without a working low water cutoff. In an emergency you can run it only while you are sitting there monitoring the water level.

You or someone could replace it with the same low water cutoff or by a Mcdonnell Miller #67 kit and mount that on the gauge glass tapings.

If you run without a functioning LWCO your run the risk of cracking the boiler or a fire.

Steamhead

@HeatingN00b , this is the one you want. It fits the 69 series too:

https://www.supplyhouse.com/Mcdonnell-Miller-153825-6667-Insert-for-Series-67-Low-Water-Cut-Off

HeatingN00b

EBEBRATT-Ed said:

@HeatingN00b The low water cutoff is a safety control that shuts the burner off when the water gets too low. You should NOT run the boiler without a working low water cutoff. In an emergency you can run it only while you are sitting there monitoring the water level. You or someone could replace it with the same low water cutoff or by a Mcdonnell Miller #67 kit and mount that on the gauge glass tapings. If you run without a functioning LWCO your run the risk of cracking the boiler or a fire.

Thank you for the clarification.

HeatingN00b

Steamhead said:

@HeatingN00b , this is the one you want. It fits the 69 series too: https://www.supplyhouse.com/Mcdonnell-Miller-153825-6667-Insert-for-Series-67-Low-Water-Cut-Off

Thank you will order this part soon and I'll install it.

HeatingN00b

This might be a stupid question but here goes.

After installation the low water cut off, everything was running smooth. The water was clear but after two days of running the water became brown ish. Does this mean I have to re flush my system?

neilc

that water does look murky,
what do you have for a drain?
with the boiler cool, drain it down, and refill,
fire it up, and it will murk again,
let it cool, and refill,

I went back and don't see a drain, nor a skim port,
post pictures of drains and skim ports,

HeatingN00b

neilc said:

that water does look murky, what do you have for a drain? with the boiler cool, drain it down, and refill, fire it up, and it will murk again, let it cool, and refill, I went back and don't see a drain, nor a skim port, post pictures of drains and skim ports,

Thank you for the reply. Sorry for the late response. Was dealing with water in the electrical panel.

I have never drained this boiler. My wife told me that the service guy was using a bucket to dump the water from the boiler. 

I took a few pictures and the only valve that I see was the one for the hot water on the side and 4 on the opposite side and the two on the back. I am assuming that the lowest one in the back is the drain the one that does not have a cap (assuming I will need to plug in a hose and use a bucket).

Thank you once again.

EBEBRATT-Ed

The valve in the back may or may not drain the boiler depending on the check valve near the drain. I can't tell which way the flow is. The valve may just drain the wet return. Can't tell.

mattmia2

the one with the cap is the one to use. is this a 2 pipe vapor system?

HeatingN00b

mattmia2 said:

the one with the cap is the one to use. is this a 2 pipe vapor system?

That's interesting. The cap does not look like it was ever removed. It's all rusty 😁, and the guy was here last month flushing the boiler.

What do you mean by a 2 pipe vapor system?

HeatingN00b

Might be a stupid question but.....
What are the two valve handles next to the two sight glass handles? What do they do?

CLamb

HeatingN00b said:

Might be a stupid question but.....
What are the two valve handles next to the two sight glass handles? What do they do?

Looks to me like they are Try Cocks. These are used as a backup to the sight glass to check water level. If you open one and water comes out you know the water level is at least that high. Does anybody know when they stopped being used in home boilers?

mattmia2

I ask if it is 2 pipe vapor because of the check valve, mostly they were only used with a few vapor systems but I see from another post that you have a 1 pipe system.