Why do people love being so cold in the summer?

vtfarmer

My wife and I are New England transplants to west-central Virginia and we both grew up without air conditioning (not even in our cars). Living as a adults mostly in the northeast until '20 we also did not have air conditioning, though it crept into our vehicles. (I did work for part of two years for a power company in Florida when I was just out of school and I was glad to have A/C there). Where I live now in VA we shut the windows and turn the central air on in the house when it gets to about 85 inside (and even then...) and I keep a sweatshirt in each of my vehicles to throw on in the grocery store or anywhere I need to go in the summer that's cool to about 70 when it's 92 outside.

This week we took a vacation on the NC outer banks where we rented a house with smart thermostats that were set to 71 and required a code to modify (which the property management company did not provide when asked). I go to the beach in the summer to feel warm, not feel like I should hang a side of beef in the living room so we spent most of the week with the windows that had screens in them open (and both A/C systems running 24/7 to try to cool the outdoors - I considered pulling the disconnects but didn't want to have an issue blamed on me).

Every restaurant we went to we sat outside to keep from shivering. Every store we walked into we braced ourselves for the thermal shock upon entering and exiting (and kept a rag handy for fogged glasses).

So to the point of my posting: what is it with people liking to be so cold? Specifically to the professional HVAC contractors here, why do people especially outside of the northeast insist on keeping their indoor spaces so cold when it's hot out? Are my wife and me (and the people in the towns we grew up in in VT and CT, respectively, or many other parts of the world for that matter) just freakishly tolerant of high temperatures? My neighbors who farm here in VA will throw hay bales in 90 degree heat with me and we'll demolish a large package of water bottles in an afternoon and not complain, so it's not just northeasterners.

bburd

Since air conditioning became available outside industrial settings, there has been tension between the researchers and engineers who determined the indoor design criteria for human comfort (generally 78°F and 50% RH) and the building owners and managers who saw an opportunity to draw people in by using cold indoor temperatures as a selling point in hot weather. I think this combined with the general American attitude that "if some is good, more is better". Those of us who are older remember the "air-conditioned" signs outside businesses, with icicles dripping off the lettering.

In grocery stores of course, open refrigerator and freezer cases were long the standard. Generally reclaimed refrigeration heat was used to warm the air in the stores even in the summer.

Then there are people like my mother, a lifelong Northeasterner. When she was younger, 70° F was the lowest temperature she liked in the winter. Menopause drastically changed her preferred temperature, so when she put central air in the house she had it designed to maintain 66° F in the summer. I had to remember to bring sweaters when I visited.

Personally I like it around 76° F in air conditioned space, when lightly dressed.

Hot_water_fan

Beyond personal preferences, heat is dangerous. If AC prevents some heat stroke cases, I’m all for it. 

EBEBRATT-Ed

74, 76, 78 is ok depending on the humidity, 70 is too cold and causes smashed compressors and a shortened equipment life

MikeAmann

You can be comfortable at 90 if the humidity is low.
Likewise, you can be drenched at 70 if the humidity is high.
But the device on the wall sets the temperature and does have any say so over the humidity.
A lot of people don't understand this.

And I am with you @vtfarmer , the AC goes on at 85 degrees. Fans do the job below that.

STEAM DOCTOR

It really is a personal thing. Guess you could ask the question the other way. Why are people so intolerant of the cold? I do not put on a coat unless it's single digits outside. My mother on the other hand, does not take off her coat unless it's above 80. Different strokes for different folks.

rsilvers

I certainty don't remember not having AC as a kid fondly. It was misery. It's the humidity.

That being said, I have to wear a jacket in many restaurants and movie theaters. Not because they cool down to 72F though. That would be tolerable. They often cool down to 64F. I know because I have found it so alarming that I have brought thermometers into restaurants to check.

I prefer to heat to 73F in the winter and I cool to about 76F but would prefer 74F if electricity were free.

As for why people like it 64F, that is easy. The average American has a BMI of 30 - so about 60 lbs overweight. If you were wearing a 60lb jacket made of fat, you would also want it cooled to 64.

JakeCK

I function best in the cold, while I love sitting on a hot tropical beach with a cold drink under a palm tree, I can't actually work or really do anything but sit there when it's hot. When I lived alone I would keep the house around 66f in the winter. In the summer, especially if I'm working on something, I like it around 68. And I'm not some morbidly obese person either. 

The recent holiday weekend for example I was working up on the roof of my house. It is black, and full sun starting around noonish. It was 85f but probably all of 120 to 130 on that roof. I could only work for short periods of time, 15-20 minutes, before I had to cool down. I would walk in with sweat running into my eyes and stand right in front of the ac. A project that would have taken me a day, two at most at 60f took me all of 6 days. 

Contrast that to years back when I locked my self out of my house and had to wait for the girlfriend to bring me her keys. It was December, about 25f outside, and snowy. I had a t-shirt, pants, and shoes but no socks on. I grabbed the shovel from the garage and started clearing the driveway. 30 minutes later I was still warm. Yea I felt the cold but I wasn't shivering, and actually had to limit my self so I didn't work up a sweat. That would have been dangerous. Back then I only weighed 130f.

Ahh to be 20 again, eat whatever I want, not gain a pound and have that energy level...

The point being some of us function best in the cold. And I did not have AC growing up, not even in the cars. 

Those who live in places like the deep south... That's a nope for me.

hot_rod

Dinner in a 70f restaurant then walk out into 115f as it will be today in Phoenix😎

Sort of takes the pleasure out of the dinning experience, for me anyways.

Cant be good for the human body or spirit?

vtfarmer

Great responses, thanks folks. I should have been more clear that I meant to discuss this notion that everyone is presumed to enjoy being 70f when it's 90+ outside in public or shared spaces, not to cast aspersions on folks like JakeCK who like to have their personal space cold in the summer.

I hadn't considered the obesity dimension, that's interesting.

Big Ed_4

80* with low humidity is perfect for comfort . If temperature or humidity rises or falls so does comfort .

Men and Woman temperature control systems work different and changes with time . Men went out of cave to hunt for food and blood flows along the surface , Woman's blood will flow inward to protect the baby . In our later years this will flip .

Most people today only know to adjust temperature to achieve comfort . I remember my Grandparents put bowls of water on the radiator to bring up the humidity during the winter .

The Northeast along the lower coast will have higher humidity and the higher areas with trees , the humidity would be lower . Trees help absorbs the energy from the Sun and maybe humidity .

An efficient AC system in the high humidity areas are designed smaller with a 12* differential (between outside and inside temperature) as to run longer to drop more humidity in the conditioned space . Once the humidity is out you should raise the temperature up be comfortable . Too large of a system would drop the temperature and not run long enough to remove enough humidity . Cold and damp , Moor effect . Most systems in the Northeast are put in with 20* diff designed as a balance . Because everyone is only looking at the thermometer . The Call on the Phone " Something is wrong , I can not bring the temperature down below 78* " Our reply " Well how does it feel ? "

Ac systems like in the valley of Arizona would be large just to handle the temperature .

Steamhead

Because they can.

mattmia2

why do people love being so hot in the summer?

ChrisJ

EBEBRATT-Ed said:

74, 76, 78 is ok depending on the humidity, 70 is too cold and causes smashed compressors and a shortened equipment life

Please explain this.

Why would 70, or for that matter 60 cause "smashed compressors" or shortened equipment life?   I'd argue it could extend equipment life due to less cycling.


I run my house 72 in the summer during the day and 70 at night.  My RH runs around 48% and it's set to drop the blower speed above 50% right now.

I run my heat at 70.

My indoor temp is almost the same 365 days a year 


I've run my AC cooler than 68.  I've had 41F supply temps and there was no risk to the compressor, not even the slightest as the TXVs job is to control superheat.  It doesn't care what temperature I run.  But I do have a freezestat just in case.

If a system can't handle being set to 70 without risking something I'd say it's broke.  I'm not saying it should necessarily be able to achieve this but I don't see why it should risk equipment.

To answer the OPs question, I run 72 during the day and 70 at night because it's where I'm comfortable.   I pay for comfort and 70F @ 48% is very comfortable to me.  If someone else likes 78 fine, but its not for me or anyone in my family.

This is similar to arguing over heat temperature in the winter.   Sure 65 is cheaper than 70 but so is 45.  

GroundUp

Do you heat your home to 85* all winter? Why not? I spent a good majority of my working life out in the elements. When I'm sweating my butt off all day in 100* heat, the last thing I want to do when I get home is sweat some more. My house stays 70* all summer because that's where I'm comfortable. Any warmer than that, I have trouble sleeping. Same rule applies in winter- when I'm freezing my butt off all day in -30* weather, the last thing I want to do is stay cold. The thermostat stays at 70* all winter too. I can tolerate a couple degrees less, but my other half is cold until it's 80* so the compromise is her sleeping with 7 blankets year-round.

With that said, I used to be able to tolerate heat a lot better. I've gained weight which surely doesn't help, but I also had a heat stroke while welding pipe in a 130* boiler room about 12 years ago and ever since then my tolerance gets worse and worse every year. It's gotten to the point of taking off of work on any day where the work space is over 85*. If it's out in the sun, I'm doing zero manual labor on days over 75*. Even tropical vacations are tough for me now- I always tend to get some heat stress on the first or second day and then I'm sick for a couple days after. We went to Dominican Republic 2 years ago and I spent 4 days in my hotel room trying not to throw up. This past year we went to Jamaica, and aside from walking to and from the bar, I did almost nothing and stayed in the shade the whole time to prevent getting sick. It worked.

JakeCK

GroundUp said:

Even tropical vacations are tough for me now- I always tend to get some heat stress on the first or second day and then I'm sick for a couple days after. We went to Dominican Republic 2 years ago and I spent 4 days in my hotel room trying not to throw up. This past year we went to Jamaica, and aside from walking to and from the bar, I did almost nothing and stayed in the shade the whole time to prevent getting sick. It worked.

That sucks. 

vtfarmer

JakeCK said:

GroundUp said:

Even tropical vacations are tough for me now- I always tend to get some heat stress on the first or second day and then I'm sick for a couple days after. We went to Dominican Republic 2 years ago and I spent 4 days in my hotel room trying not to throw up. This past year we went to Jamaica, and aside from walking to and from the bar, I did almost nothing and stayed in the shade the whole time to prevent getting sick. It worked.

That sucks. 

Heat stroke is no joke! I have a relative who served two tours in Iraq as a Marine infantryman and got it pretty bad, my understanding is that the sensitivity to it never really goes away. Again, I have no problem with someone keeping their home at 72 (or 62!) when it's hot out, I just wanted to get some discussion going on crazy cold public places/offices, etc.

mattmia2

The crazy cold public places has part to do with the discussion about not being able to get competent people in the trade for what owners collectively will pay and part to do with the workers doing work and wearing uniforms and dress clothes that retain a lot more heat than your street clothes and them being the ones controlling the thermostat.

mattmia2

Then there's this:
https://heatinghelp.com/blog/thermostat-adventures/

MaxMercy

Totally agree. I now carry a sweater if we go out to eat.

I can't wait for that first warm day of spring when I can open my car windows and let the warm air in, yet people are driving around with their AC on when it's 75 and low humidity.

I'm more prone to use my car AC when it's 65 and HUMID - at that point I'll run the AC on recirc and add some heat.

KC_Jones

If I’m doing physical work of any kind, even light work, anything above 55-60 is “hot” to me. I did hardwood floors in a house with the AC set to 70 and was leaving puddles on the floor from my head, the brim of the hat drips when I get going.

Because people like me exist is why the public spaces are like that. Eating, with respect to me sweating, constitutes physical work and I can sweat. I assure you, you don’t want to look over and see me sweating while you are eating, trust me on that one. I hate it as much as people who live with me.

Also, you can apply a sweater, I can’t get naked to cool off. 

ChrisJ

KC_Jones said:

If I’m doing physical work of any kind, even light work, anything above 55-60 is “hot” to me. I did hardwood floors in a house with the AC set to 70 and was leaving puddles on the floor from my head, the brim of the hat drips when I get going.

Because people like me exist is why the public spaces are like that. Eating, with respect to me sweating, constitutes physical work and I can sweat. I assure you, you don’t want to look over and see me sweating while you are eating, trust me on that one. I hate it as much as people who live with me.

Also, you can apply a sweater, I can’t get naked to cool off. 

"Apply a sweater"

Yes KC, please, invoke clothes when dining. We appreciate it.

hot_rod

What a conundrum in the restaurant business. Kitchen staff working around hot ovens and grills, massive exhaust hoods above, and AC trying to maintain 70F
Thermodynamic imbalance at it worse!

JUGHNE

We were at a newly build chain restaurant for lunch.

We got seated near the kitchen double doors. The temp was comfortable until those doors were opened and the cold air spilled out.

I thought this was the exception and maybe the exhaust hood was not working. The china plates were so cold that the food cooled quickly.

Usually plates are scorching hot (burn your hands) and the food is cool/cold.

GGross

@JUGHNE
The cold air spilled out from the kitchen? That might concern me a little, what kind of commercial kitchen isn't just uncomfortably hot all the time? maybe one that uses a microwave primarily

ChrisJ

GGross said:

@JUGHNE
The cold air spilled out from the kitchen? That might concern me a little, what kind of commercial kitchen isn't just uncomfortably hot all the time? maybe one that uses a microwave primarily

Sounds like they're trying to cool people as best they can and that's hard next to hot ovens etc.

Or, maybe it's just pooling up next to the doors etc.

JUGHNE

The plates felt like they came out of a fridge and you know they were stacked close to the grill. So that area was pretty cool.

I wanted to talk to the manager and suggest a plate warmer.

I'll make a point to eat there again when in that area.

Probably not big on microwave cooking.
This is pancake/eggs/bacon place with the large US flag flying.
So I am imagining large griddle.....fired by GAS!

SlamDunk

We keep our facilty with 400 people at 70 +/-2 year round. We get calls for more heat or less heat all year long.

vtfarmer

GroundUp said:

Do you heat your home to 85* all winter?

Ahhhhhhh


Seriously though, we keep the heat pumps at 72 or 73 and run the wood stove to keep it in the 76-78 range when it's humid or windy out in the winter.

SlamDunk

No! we keep our house roughly 74 year round.

At work, we have folks who dress like it is summer year round and complain-year round. And we have folks on blood thinners who we bend over backwards to make comfortable.