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Surge Prevention for Larger Boilers

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We do several Residential Boiler Installations per month. We always include two Skimming Sessions (A session is about 90 minutes give or take) per Installation to help with Surging that can come from the Oil and Old Pipe Condensate runback.
We are running into problems though with our Larger Boiler Replacements for Larger Systems; particularly for Churches.
Does anyone have input or recommendations for dealing with Surging on New Installations for these larger projects? We seem to have to go out once per week with some of them simply because of Surging causing the MLWCO to trip.

Comments

  • PetriChris11
    PetriChris11 Member Posts: 5
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    For reference:
    We skim the boiler after one week and then after six weeks. For Residential Boilers, we rarely have to go a third time.
    We skimmed this Church Boiler four times. I am hoping to find preventions or include clauses moving forward.
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 8,157
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    What is your water chemistry? PH, mineral content, and the like? You may need some water treatment.

    What does the water returning from the old system look like? Is there a strainer in that line to collect any of that sludge?

    What does the skimmed surface water look like coming out of that boiler? Put a clean bucket under the waterfall.

    Edward Young Retired

    After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?

  • ethicalpaul
    ethicalpaul Member Posts: 5,761
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    More questions:
    - Are you piping it per the installation manual?
    - Did you try using TSP or washing soda after install? (Peerless recommends this)
    NJ Steam Homeowner. See my sight glass boiler videos: https://bit.ly/3sZW1el
    EdTheHeaterManmattmia2
  • JUGHNE
    JUGHNE Member Posts: 11,095
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    Have you considered "wand washing".

    Search this wall for a Utube.

    Really cleans the inside of the boiler.

    Easy if you have CO ports and a floor drain is handy.
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 9,850
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    Are you following the instructions about where to put the skim port? A drop header won't stop the surging but it will keep most of the water from going out in to the system. Are you adding too much treatment and causing priming?
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 15,767
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    What kind of boiler? Cast Iron I use TSP. Never had to do one more than once if it was piped right.

    1 lb of TSP/50 gallons of boiler water
  • PetriChris11
    PetriChris11 Member Posts: 5
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    Awesome! Some more info on our work on this particular job:
    -I attached a few pictures of our Installation.




    -We do not fully repipe the Boiler, just the NBP.
    -It is a SteamMax STMX550.
    -We test the PH standard on our one week follow up and it was a hair under 11.

    I also meant for more general applications as well. More commercial spaces are requesting our services due to our growth, especially old churches, and my goal is to build an Add On package that would better prevent this (more piping, more services).
    Hopefully this all makes sense; super busy so my brain is buzzing.
  • PetriChris11
    PetriChris11 Member Posts: 5
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    ....The ceiling was not us by the way
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 15,870
    edited December 2022
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    Is that header big enough for two boilers dumping into it? I've got a feeling it's not.


    That aside, I'd recommend wand washing with hot water. Other's like Paul can recommend chemicals etc to help rinse it out as well.
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 9,850
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    At a ph of 11 it might be priming.
  • PetriChris11
    PetriChris11 Member Posts: 5
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    -First Time installing this new weird Burnham Dual slash Single Unit but when we spoke to them about the piping they approved the above. Good idea to reach out to them though again afterward so that is smart.
    -Any recommendation on a chemical? A new Tech recommends a product called SurgeX; anyone ever use it? We are New School run but Old School owned so we never use chemicals really.
    -Never heard of Wand Washing but I am going to dig into it now! We usually do the old school "Pencil Thin Line" method.