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Need help finding replacement for ancient circulator.

Hockeypuck
Hockeypuck Member Posts: 5
in THE MAIN WALL
System: GE down-draft boiler, hot water/radiator. Age: 60+ years
Parts that need to be repaired/replaced: circulator motor and perhaps pump.

Sunday morning the motor on my circulator fried. Parts are no longer made, and the modern motors do not appear to be able to be modified to work. The shaft on the pump can be turned, but I’m not certain if there was any internal damage.

The best suggestion I’ve had was to find a plumber willing to remove the old 4-bolt flange circulator, (approx. 12”) and replace with a new unit and motor. New units seem to be all 2-bolt, and significantly shorter than the old one. It may very well be an industrial pump.

I’m trying to find parts; does anyone have a source for a circulator and motor from the stone age?




Comments

  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 17,215
    Wow, an original GE circulator!

    You'll need to replace the flanges and change the length of one of the pipes for a new circ to fit.

    How much radiation is on the system? Was it originally a gravity system?
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Towson, MD, USA
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
    mattmia2
  • Hockeypuck
    Hockeypuck Member Posts: 5
    The tech that looked at it says it’s a gravity system, but I think otherwise: he left the furnace on so it would “gravity heat”, but radiators have been cold for 48 hours.
    House is a small two-story; four radiators upstairs, seven on main floor.
  • PC7060
    PC7060 Member Posts: 1,296
    Do you have a old school compression tank up in the joists near the boiler?  There may be a valve similar to the one below which can be adjusted to allow gravity flow. Post a few pictures of the tank and valve so we can get a better idea of the layout. 

  • Hockeypuck
    Hockeypuck Member Posts: 5
    A tank is in one spot, and what looks like an emergency pressure release in another.






  • PC7060
    PC7060 Member Posts: 1,296
    edited January 2022
    The green tank is part of the thrush system like the one in the photo I posted.

    Can you find a part number or patent number on the red egg?

    Edited: Based on the label its a combo feed and over pressure relief valve. 

    Can you post a picture showing the connection to the green tank?


  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 22,814
    The 1/6 hp would be a starting point to identify that circulators capacity
    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 10,368
    A magnetic dirt separator would probably be a good idea too to protect the new wet rotor pump. This isn't by any chance monoflow?
  • Ironman
    Ironman Member Posts: 7,441
    Not that, it’s a relief valve.

    You’re looking for a flow control valve. Turning the lever fully clockwise will raise the disc inside to allow gravity flow.


    Bob Boan
    You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 10,368
    edited January 2022
    That red grenade thing looks like it is just a very old pressure relief valve.

    Er relief and pressure reducing feed valve combo.
  • PC7060
    PC7060 Member Posts: 1,296
    What @Ironman said. It will look like the unit I posted or similar to the ones he posted. 
  • Hockeypuck
    Hockeypuck Member Posts: 5
    The green tank simply has a pipe connected; no valves, no settings.
  • PC7060
    PC7060 Member Posts: 1,296
    Yes but what does it connect to? The red egg?
  • PC7060
    PC7060 Member Posts: 1,296
    edited January 2022
    The water will want to flow up from the boiler into the distribution pipes. Look for a large valve in line with the primary flow piping. It’s probably a large pipe 1-1/2 to 2”. 

    Post a picture of the boiler and the upper piping. 
  • Hockeypuck
    Hockeypuck Member Posts: 5
    Other than the pressure relief egg, there doesn’t appear to be any control valves, only shut-off valves.
    The green tank is above and about 3’ to the right of the furnace.The red egg is above and about 3’ to the left of the furnace. There is no direct connection.
    I can make a short video “tour” tomorrow morning.
    BTW, the system has no doubt been Frankensteined over the decades.
  • PC7060
    PC7060 Member Posts: 1,296
    Should be something like this configuration.

  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 10,368
    There is no reason for a flow check valve if there is a single zone and dhw comes from a different source. If it is monoflow it won't circulate through the emitters very well without the circulator.
    Hockeypuck said:


    BTW, the system has no doubt been Frankensteined over the decades.

    What we've seen so far looks pretty original to the 1940's
  • tim smith
    tim smith Member Posts: 2,800
    That's the oldest B&g fill valve I've seen. The pump, if added would be restricting gravity flow along with if there is a flo check. Good luck figuring out. Won't need much flow if old gravity. 1558 probably. 
  • tim smith
    tim smith Member Posts: 2,800
    What type of radiators and how many sq feet is house?
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 10,368
    @Hockeypuck, some pictures of the mains where a radiator or 2 connects from far enough back to see the whole picture would tell us some things too.
  • ScottSecor
    ScottSecor Member Posts: 878
    edited January 2022
    Flanges will be very dificult to match up to a new pump. I suspect that is a older Thrush pump, most GE boilers in NJ were fitted with Thrush or Taco circulator pumps. I would suggest a 1725 rpm pump again as you likely need volume and not a lot of head.
  • EricPeterson
    EricPeterson Member Posts: 215
    What is the purpose of the second circulator (B&G) in that last picture? 
  • WMno57
    WMno57 Member Posts: 1,408
    edited January 2022
    ScottSecor said:

    I suspect that is a older Thrush pump, most GE boilers in NJ were fitted with Thrush or Taco circulator pumps.

    Thrush is still in business. Maybe they have a new motor or circulator for you.
    https://www.thrushco.com/hydronic-pumps
    Thrush Company, Inc.
    340 W. 8th Street
    Peru, IN 46970
    Phone: 765-472-3351
  • Jimbabwe
    Jimbabwe Member Posts: 10
    I noticed no one suggested looking into having the motor itself repaired. Electric motor ships have the ability to repair most issues with motors, and obviously this can be costly but from the look of things, you’re well into costly territory as is. New circulators are not cheap to begin with and it certainly will require some tripping work as well. Just a thought. And seeing marvelously well built machines from a long lost time when they were made to last is near and dear to my heart so selfishly I’d love to see that old chunk of iron go for many more years. Anyway, hope all works out well. 
    DaveinscrantonRobert_25
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 10,368
    I'm not convinced that the motor isn't a common shaft and mounting format although not the standard form.
  • Daveinscranton
    Daveinscranton Member Posts: 148
    If the pump volute and rotor are ok, and bearing is ok, maybe fabrication of a bracket to adapt any 1725 rpm motor that is roughly the same size could be considered.  Or 2 pulleys and a belt.  Not a great solution but better than no heat.  I grew up in an environment where such patches had to be considered.  No choice.  Things are different now.  Grateful for that.  Still helpful in a jam.
  • MikeAmann
    MikeAmann Member Posts: 998
    This might be worth a look: https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2380057.m570.l1313&_nkw=thrush+circulator&_sacat=0

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