Noisy circulator, what needs service?

Jells

This circulator seems unhappy. Any ideas? Could it be the check valve or the cartridge?

https://youtu.be/SHb_O57IwbA

bucksnort

As cheap as new ones are and how old yours looks, just put a complete new one in.

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

Sounds like some debris (solder?) pinging around in the volute. If you're up for it, isolate the pump and take the 4 screws out that hold the motor to the volute and see what's in there.

That's a Taco priority zoned circulator; coupla' hundred bucks for the whole thing; cheaper if you just buy the cartridge.

https://www.supplyhouse.com/Taco-007-ZF5-3IFC-007-Cast-Iron-Priority-Zoning-Circulator-w-Integral-Flow-Check-1-25-HP

https://www.supplyhouse.com/Taco-007-063RP-Replacement-Cartridge-Assembly-For-Cast-Iron-Series-007-F7-007-3-speed

HomerJSmith

If you so take it apart turn the impeller and see if it turns readily. The cost of a cartridge is almost the cost of a whole pump. Time and cost wise, I just replace the whole thing. But, that is a bronze pump which is much more expensive and it may be soldered in. In that case I would just replace the cartridge if needed. That pump wasn't really installed correctly, but what the hay.

Jells

HomerJSmith said:

If you so take it apart turn the impeller and see if it turns readily. The cost of a cartridge is almost the cost of a whole pump. Time and cost wise, I just replace the whole thing. But, that is a bronze pump which is much more expensive and it may be soldered in. In that case I would just replace the cartridge if needed. That pump wasn't really installed correctly, but what the hay.

Care to explain what isn't correct about the install? This was originally by a local heating pro, but I don't recall if I changed much when I swapped the tank a while back. And yes it's sweated in.

pecmsg

Jells said:

HomerJSmith said:

If you so take it apart turn the impeller and see if it turns readily. The cost of a cartridge is almost the cost of a whole pump. Time and cost wise, I just replace the whole thing. But, that is a bronze pump which is much more expensive and it may be soldered in. In that case I would just replace the cartridge if needed. That pump wasn't really installed correctly, but what the hay.

Care to explain what isn't correct about the install? This was originally by a local heating pro, but I don't recall if I changed much when I swapped the tank a while back. And yes it's sweated in.

Isolation Valves so it can be serviced without draining the System!

Dave H_2

That noise could be from several contributing factors; the bearings or the impeller. But with that, they are both in the same component - the cartridge.
But id you are going to replace the cartridge, unfortunately do NOT pick the ones that @Alan (California Radiant) Forbes suggested from Supplyhouse.com. Those are for Cast Iron 007.
From this angle, I am not sure of the model (00) but I can tell its a bronze circ by the color of the circ. Not sure of the application, but if this is in a recirc system for DHW and an open system, then that cast iron ones would seize up rather quickly.

Dave H.

Jells

@pecmsg It's over the tank and the loop is on the floor, system doesn't need to drain to service it.

@dave H_2 Yes, it's bronze. I've replaced impellers before, I've got 4 of these system. But I recall that it didn't solve the problem then. Perhaps @Alan (California Radiant) Forbes might be right there's debris somewhere, like in the check valves.

hot_rod

Sweat body pump with internal checks, hmmmm.
Is this one of the models that had the check on the inlet hole of the volute? If so, time for a different version. A check at the suction of a circulator is never a good application.
If for some reason it needs to be non ferrous, most circulators are stainless steel bodies now.

Jells

hot_rod said:

Sweat body pump with internal checks, hmmmm.
Is this one of the models that had the check on the inlet hole of the volute? If so, time for a different version. A check at the suction of a circulator is never a good application.
If for some reason it needs to be non ferrous, most circulators are stainless steel bodies now.

Why is the internal check so bad? I guess it can be dispensed with, the system has two 3/4" checks inline also. As far as I can tell there's plenty of cast iron as well as bronze out there, this needs to be non-ferrous because it's circulating potable.

Grallert

The only bronze component on the circ is the volute if I'm not mistaken. So it can stay. replace the cartridge if they are still available.

hot_rod

Jells said:

hot_rod said:

Sweat body pump with internal checks, hmmmm.
Is this one of the models that had the check on the inlet hole of the volute? If so, time for a different version. A check at the suction of a circulator is never a good application.
If for some reason it needs to be non ferrous, most circulators are stainless steel bodies now.

Why is the internal check so bad? I guess it can be dispensed with, the system has two 3/4" checks inline also. As far as I can tell there's plenty of cast iron as well as bronze out there, this needs to be non-ferrous because it's circulating potable.

The spring loaded IFC checks are common in most small circulators discharge ports these days, in most cases they work find. If you add a check in the piping I would only use a spring type that is designed for hydronic applications. The check should be sized for the flow rate, with the Cv number, not by pipe size.
A chattering check is either debris, air, or lack of adequate flow to fully open the check.

If you have replaced multiple circulators, impellers and checks there must be some other problem. Properly applied a small residential circulator should provide 10- 15 years of trouble-free service.

Is this an open system, one that sees continuous fresh water added, circulators in those conditions seem to be shorter lived.

Jells

hot_rod said:

Jells said:

hot_rod said:

Sweat body pump with internal checks, hmmmm.
Is this one of the models that had the check on the inlet hole of the volute? If so, time for a different version. A check at the suction of a circulator is never a good application.
If for some reason it needs to be non ferrous, most circulators are stainless steel bodies now.

Why is the internal check so bad? I guess it can be dispensed with, the system has two 3/4" checks inline also. As far as I can tell there's plenty of cast iron as well as bronze out there, this needs to be non-ferrous because it's circulating potable.

The spring loaded IFC checks are common in most small circulators discharge ports these days, in most cases they work find. If you add a check in the piping I would only use a spring type that is designed for hydronic applications. The check should be sized for the flow rate, with the Cv number, not by pipe size.
A chattering check is either debris, air, or lack of adequate flow to fully open the check.

If you have replaced multiple circulators, impellers and checks there must be some other problem. Properly applied a small residential circulator should provide 10- 15 years of trouble-free service.

Is this an open system, one that sees continuous fresh water added, circulators in those conditions seem to be shorter lived.

Good food for thought, thanks. The 3/4 inline spring checks are what's recommended for this system, and I think would only be a problem if there was a failure like the spring. The pump is from 2003, I guess its given pretty good service! I'll replace the cartridge and see how it does.

pecmsg

Jells said:

@pecmsg It's over the tank and the loop is on the floor, system doesn't need to drain to service it.

@dave H_2 Yes, it's bronze. I've replaced impellers before, I've got 4 of these system. But I recall that it didn't solve the problem then. Perhaps @Alan (California Radiant) Forbes might be right there's debris somewhere, like in the check valves.

any water thats above the pump needs to be drained!