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Looking for Pros and Cons on a Oil Boiler

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witz1976
witz1976 Member Posts: 6
Hello,

Newbie here, looking for some information. I have to replace the 30+ year boiler I have and I am looking for efficiency as well as longevity. So because of that I am looking at a low mass triple pass boilers with a indirect HW tank.

The first quote is for a PurePro Trio with a 40gal indirect. I am not certain if they included the energy manager or not, I am trying to get an answer.

The second quote is a System 2000 EK1

Third is a Biassi B10/4 with a 40 gal indirect tank.

I know pricing is not allowed, but I can say the Trio and Sys2K are super close. The Biassi is way higher, so that alone is making me step away from it. But that said, I am curious to know thoughts on these, what are the pros and cons.

Thanks!

Comments

  • STEVEusaPA
    STEVEusaPA Member Posts: 6,505
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    2, then 2, then 2, then 1, then 3.
    But make sure a proper heat loss was performed so you don’t oversize the boiler.

    There was an error rendering this rich post.

    rick in AlaskaHVACNUTwitz1976Roger
  • witz1976
    witz1976 Member Posts: 6
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    Thanks @STEVEusaPA , can you elaborate as to why?
  • Jamie Hall
    Jamie Hall Member Posts: 23,443
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    Step one. Do a proper heat loss. If this is steam, measure the connected radiation. If this is hot water, calculate the heat loss of the building. Why? If the boiler power does not match the load placed on it will be unhappy (and so will you). An undersized boiler simply won't heat the building. An oversized boiler will be cycling on and off and on and off and be inefficient.

    Step two. Find and hire a really competent contractor to do the job. You may express your preference as to boiler to him or her, but he or she may have equipment which they prefer to work with. The installer is the most important thing. The best boiler in the world will be junk unless it's properly installed -- and a good installer can make a pretty poor boiler work well (but would much rather not, thank you).
    Br. Jamie, osb
    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England
    witz1976
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 15,628
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    Go with the EK if you have a good EK installer in your area
    witz1976Roger
  • witz1976
    witz1976 Member Posts: 6
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    @Jamie Hall Thank you for the input. I failed to mention this is a Hot water Baseboard system. The reason why I need to replace is the boiler has a flue collar that is 2/3 corroded and is currently sealed thanks to high temp silicone. I also was told the insulation where the flame makes contact with the back of the firebox is burned through and gone.

    The estimates I have gotten are from well recommended heating contractors. When they informed me of their recommended boilers, the ones who recommended the Biasi and the Trio said they worked on them for years and told me to stay away from the Sys 2k. Which makes sense as not everyone can sell a Sys 2K.
  • neilc
    neilc Member Posts: 2,708
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    "not everyone can sell a Sys 2K. " because 2K makes the go to training before they can sell or install,
    search here for the 2Ks, I don't think I remember anyone being unhappy
    known to beat dead horses
    Roger
  • subcooler_65
    subcooler_65 Member Posts: 20
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    Isn't the PurePro a rebranded Biasi? I always liked the Biasi boiler.
  • Roger
    Roger Member Posts: 333
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    Thank you for your post, @witz1976 .  System 2000 is a proven 30 year boiler (and we say that because so many are still running strong after over 40 years). 
    The most appreciated benefits are usually cited as best efficiency (Dept of Energy Lab study covering oil and gas boilers), whisper quiet operation, and nearly endless hot water.  It has nearly all industry standard parts, and the Energy Manager control has a lifetime protection plan and can be bypassed in a few minutes for emergency heat. 
    On occasion, we’re recognized for super responsive customer service and support (although it’s not always Christmas Eve like today). 
    We also provide tech support and parts to any heating pro, but as mentioned above we only sell boilers to factory trained and supported dealers; we know their techs, installers, and management, and they are typically at least a cut above if not the top rated contractors in their market area.
    Please contact us or post if you have specific questions. 
    Thank you and enjoy your holiday!
    Roger
    President
    Energy Kinetics, Inc.
    rick in Alaskawitz1976STEVEusaPAErin Holohan Haskell
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 8,105
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    Hay, @witz1976
    Take a look at the last Post, Roger is a member of the Energy Kinetics team. They manufacturer the EK boilers, Has anyone from Baissi or PurePro Trio come to talk to you here?

    Don't hold your breath, EK has the best dealers and support system. And they are pretty efficient to operate also

    Edward Young Retired

    After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?

    witz1976
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 16,901
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    @witz1976 , you can't go wrong with any of these as long it's sized and installed correctly. Where are you located?
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Towson, MD, USA
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • witz1976
    witz1976 Member Posts: 6
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    @Steamhead I am living in Southern Maine.
  • witz1976
    witz1976 Member Posts: 6
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    @Roger Thank you for the response. Some of the "words of caution" i got from the other contractors was 1. the insulation in the pressure vessel is prone to cracking and crumbling, which is super expensive to replace. 2. the electronics are proprietary and when they fail it could be a while to replace unless the dealer stocks (also super expensive) and 3 is the firebox design is super gimickey.

    These are their words. But could you tell me about your MTBFs for the insulation and electronics?
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 15,628
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    @witz1976
    EK is the top of the line. The other contractors that are not EK certified will say they are NG because they can't install them.

    As @Steamhead they are all ok if sized and installed right. Has any of you proposed installers done heat loss?
  • Dave T_2
    Dave T_2 Member Posts: 64
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    System 2000 is your best and most efficient choice. Any dealer will stock parts and the parts are not over priced.
  • Roger
    Roger Member Posts: 333
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    Thank you for your candor and question, @witz1976 .  
    Instead of MTBF figures, I’ll offer you the following: The insulation we used 25 years ago should last 25+ years if properly serviced and the refractory we have used since the 1990’s is much better and built to last the life of the boiler. This is also true for the chamber/firebox - it’s also a near perfect burning environment that’s unsurpassed on any oilheat system. After a 41 year proven track record, it’s safe to say I disagree with the cracking/crumbling/unavailable/expensive/gimmicky conjecture, even if it were based on systems over a quarter century old. 
    We also have what is essentially whole house surge protection on the circuit board which protects all the components from the burner and circulator to our manager. The manager MTBF is comparable to or better than industry standard electronics and the price is posted on our website  https://energykinetics.com/system2000-parts-trade-list-price/ . I don’t know of any other company that has this type of electronics coverage or protection. The manager is as fast to get as UPS from New Jersey (our regional warehouses and local territory managers in New England, mid-Atlantic states and Alaska also stock them), you can run emergency heat without the manager, or you could opt to keep a “service board” on hand (this plugs in in a minute and makes the boiler run like a conventional boiler).
    Best,
    Roger
    President
    Energy Kinetics, Inc.
    rick in AlaskaSTEVEusaPAErin Holohan Haskellwitz1976
  • Erin Holohan Haskell
    Erin Holohan Haskell Member, Moderator, Administrator Posts: 2,326
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    @witz1976, when you have @Roger, President of Energy Kinetics, answering your questions on Christmas Eve...now that's customer service.

    President
    HeatingHelp.com

    Rogerwitz1976CLamb
  • witz1976
    witz1976 Member Posts: 6
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    @Roger thank you for taking the time to discuss this, especially on Christmas Eve. Seeing the CEO check the boards and discuss these does speak volumes about the company as a whole.

    The pricing on the parts are really not as expensive as I was thinking based off the comments from the competitors, thank you for providing this list.

    I would also like to thank all who has commented. Merry Christmas.

    RogerErin Holohan Haskell