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Wanted: 12 x 48 Plain Steel Compression Tank 24 Gallon

WMno57
WMno57 Member Posts: 205
edited December 2020 in Buy, Sell, Barter
************ UPDATE****************
No longer in the market for a tank. I now have a new tank in my boiler room. Thank you to the WALL. Watch for details on the Main Wall.


The old fashioned no bladder tank that hangs in the basement ceiling joist bay.

I'll also pay for packing and shiping, or if your within a couple hours I can pick up.

Thanks

Comments

  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 15,003
    12X32"?
    Here is a tank, like new. I TIG welded some extra connections for a solar drainback demo. You can have it if you want to pay shipping from SW Missouri.
    I know Able Distributing in Chicago keeps several sizes of new tanks in stock, might give them a call.
    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
  • WMno57
    WMno57 Member Posts: 205
    Thanks Hot Rod. I will call Able first thing tomorrow.

    12 x 32 is 75% of what I have in there now. Might work, might not. I appreciate the offer.
  • WMno57
    WMno57 Member Posts: 205
    edited December 2020
    Update for the Wall.

    My contractor called all his supply houses. None of them could get a plain steel compression tank. He told me he and his employee would be willing to pipe up a tank that I source.

    My contractor and I have spent too much time sourcing the tank. All but one of the businesses I spoke with were helpful and professional.

    I DO NOT RECOMMEND ABLE DISTRIBUTORS of Chicago. They were rude. It's more than that, but I'm not going to get into it here.

    Fingers crossed, I think I have a tank sourced from a business, that has been very helpful and professional. I will post their name later if they wish.
  • JUGHNE
    JUGHNE Member Posts: 8,924
    The website you showed in your first posting had a guide chart for sizing by btu connected. Things were often oversized years ago so the smaller size may work.
  • JUGHNE
    JUGHNE Member Posts: 8,924
    I have a 12 x 32 that was a take out.
    Someone was trying to use it for a condensate accumulator on a steamer. Fairly new, has 2 bottom ports and end ports for sight glass even. Center bottom is 3/4, all others 1/2".
    In northern Nebr.
  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 15,003
    Personally I would go with a diaphragm tank and a good microbubble air separator :) The tank would be 1/3 the size, not have air maintenance issues, and less standby heat loss.
    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
    STEVEusaPASolid_Fuel_Man
  • WMno57
    WMno57 Member Posts: 205
    @JUGHNE

    Very true. My math in my earlier post was incorrect. Hot Rod's 12 x 32 is 66% of my 12 x 48.

    In any case, size is not the obstacle in getting a tank. I have only been able to find two manufactures of compression tanks. Thrush and John Wood. Thrush does not actually make them. They are made for Thrush.
  • JUGHNE
    JUGHNE Member Posts: 8,924
    edited December 2020
    The tank in my shop still has the label.

    Quality Tanks Inc.
    608 Delco Drive
    Clinton WI
    53525

    608-676-2281

    Give that a try.
    Let us know.
  • WMno57
    WMno57 Member Posts: 205
    @hot_rod You're not the first person to recomend a new style tank.

    The current tank fits just fine in the joist bay. I'm capable of maintenance. I'm not trying to earn the AOC "green" merit badge, and the bottom of my current tank feels room temp.

    I also have an all stock and original 1988 Ford Pickup with an all mechanical Diesel engine. It has ZERO electronics. If it gets to the point I can't source consumable parts for it, I'll get another truck. I'm not going to hack a 6 dot oh no, or a DuraMax into it.

    This winter someone on this board will have will have vehicle trouble. Not me.

    Charcoal fire under the oil pan
    Shot glass of gas in the air intake
    Push it with another truck

    I've never had to do any of the above to this truck. But I could, and I would if I had to. I have done all the above to other equipment over the years.

    In ten years many of the techs on this board will be driving electric vans. They will not be serviceable. They will probably be leased, as no one would want to own one.

    If I can't source consumable parts for my hydronic system, I'll get another system. I might lease it.

  • WMno57
    WMno57 Member Posts: 205
    edited December 2020
    hot_rod said:

    not have air maintenance issues

    When I bought this house two years ago, i had the local HVAC man check the system at the start of the season. I was a hydronic newbie and knew nothing. The compression tank was waterlogged and he drained it. I watched and took notes.

    Over the next two years I would occasionally bleed minor amounts of air out of the radiators. Mostly the single radiator on the second floor. This house was originally 4 rads on 2nd, and 7 rads on 1st. Now it's 1 on 2, and 8 on 1. Most of the minor amount of air that I have bled for my entire ownership has been that single radiator on the second floor. Easy peasy.

    During the last two years I NEVER TOUCHED the compression tank. Why should I. I was monitoring the pressure guage, and it did not show signs of waterlogging. This year at the start of the season, the pressure guage told me the tank was water logged. So I drained it. It took at most 15 minutes. I took my time, did not touch the vacuum breaker, and used the gulp gulp gulp method. Same as my contractor two years ago.

    There is no Airtrol on my tank. The drain is a nipple with a gas ball valve.

    Note the 70+ year old OEM brass "Thrush" signed plug in the vacuum breaker.

    What are air maintenance issues?



  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 10,209
    @WMno57

    Just so you know, with a compression tank do not install any automatic air vents, they let air out of the system and will water log a tank

    Also, why don't you call John Wood directly and tell them your going to have your contractor order a tank but he can't find one.

    They should know which of their distributors has one in stock
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 14,829
    Still showing one at R.E. Michel.
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • WMno57
    WMno57 Member Posts: 205
    edited December 2020
    @EBEBRATT-Ed

    I did call John Wood directly on 12/01. It was at lunch time, and I left a voice mail stating exactly what you suggested. An hour and 45 minutes later I got a call back from a gentleman who was both helpful and professional. He directed me to Ferguson Enterprises. He told me Ferguson has John Wood tanks in stock. He also told me they sold to the public.

    I then called a Ferguson Enterprises branch in the Chicago area. I spoke with a woman who was very nice. I explained the situation, gave her both the John Wood and Thrush part numbers, and my contractor's contact information. She told me they do not sell to the public because they "sold things that go boom". However she was willing to work with and help me because I had a contractor. She listened to me, told me she had been in the business for 40 years, and knew what I was talking about. She did keep saying "that's just an expansion tank, right". After several minutes she told me, "I can't get get either of those parts, they are not in my system, we are the HVAC branch. You need to call the plumbing branch in Addison and ask for Boiler Sales"

    I then called the Ferguson branch in Addison and asked for Boiler Sales. Got a younger guy, very nice. We talked for 5 minutes and he told me he would call me back the next day. I remember him asking me if there was any time of morning that was too early. I was impressed by this, thinking great, he will have something for me tomorrow AM. He never called back. That was two days ago.

    I also called Thursh on 11/31. They gave me a name of a steam supply house in the Chicago area. I called the steam Supply house on 11/31, they emailed me a quote with a high (IMO) price, THE SAME DAY. So I sat on the quote for 2 days.

    Today when I woke up I told myself "Enough!". Called my sales rep at the steam supply house, secretary said he was out for the day, she connected me to another sales rep, he was able to access my quote without me having the quote number (It was on another of my computers). I had to create an account with them (no big deal). Couple of e-mails back and forth. Last e-mail from my salesman said "your order is placed, I will contact you with the Will Call details". I asked for a will call pickup because I will sleep better when I get my pipe plugged tank out of there. I'll be driving 4 hours round trip to pick it up at Thrush's warehouse.

    I would have liked to have had a price on the John Wood, but how much of my and my contractors time should that take?

    My contractor is the owner. He has been in business for 40 years. His dad had the business before him. He called his three main supply houses. None them could get it.

    Your industry has a lot of problems. They are not my problems, they are the problems of the HVAC Industry. These issues will hit many of you in the pocketbook in the future. Manufactures, Wholesalers, and Installers. New businesses, and new business models, that do not exist today will come along and take advantage of the ineptitude and inefficiencies. It has already happened in other industries.
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 14,829
    This is the complete opposite of the experiences I have had. We've ordered this type of tank several times and it always arrives in a day or two.

    I think the guy who drove 2 hours to pick up the tank deserves your future business. The others? Naaaah.
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 10,209
    Ferguson is at fault here. It's true that a lot (maybe most) of the supply houses don't want to deal with homeowners.

    I have the same issue myself......now. I worked in the business for 46 years and am now retired.

    I still do jobs for family, friends etc and installed a boiler a month ago.

    I don't buy much so I don't have an account, I go in and pick up what I need and pay cash.

    Most of the supply houses I go to know me so I don't get much grief that way

    But they give me no discount, (except for one HVAC supplier that treats me fairly) I am getting screwed (well actually my "customers" are) Irks me a little when I was working and quoting $500,000 dollar jobs they all new my name and begged me for some business. Dropped me like a hot potato LOL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    The first women at Ferguson should have helped you, it's all the same company and they ship parts between branches all the time.

    But even if she didn't there is no excuse for the second guy not to call you back.

    I know the inside sales people are busy and have bigger fish to fry, but if you say your gonna call....then call.

    But they look on you (and me now as well) as "one shot deals" sell me something and and probably never need them again

    Unfortunately, that's the way business is done today, all e-mails, little voice or person to person contact

    Fewer "local" supply houses, the chains are taking over.

    Ferguson, FW Webb etc

    They build there business on VOLUME.......NOT service

    But then again i am old school

    No cell phones beepers or fax machines or computers when I started

    When I quoted a big job in the 70s you would call the supply house with a list or drop it off.......................................and the you would get your quote 4-5 days later in the mail

    MY Rant
  • WMno57
    WMno57 Member Posts: 205
    I didn't word that right. I'm taking a road trip because my old tank is on its last legs, and the thrush website shows a floor mount pic, but a ceiling mount drawing and spec.
  • WMno57
    WMno57 Member Posts: 205
    edited December 2020
    R E Michel out of Crown Point was the other John Wood distributor. I talked to them, they were nice, told me it was out of stock and back ordered for the entire company. I told them there were some tanks in-stock at an R E Michel in Baltimore. Guy said he would look into it and call me back next day. Again several days later, no call back.

    Like I said, not my problem, their problem.

    Years ago I was in Home Depot shopping for garage door springs. Associate on the floor told me they were dangerous, and it was illegal for them to sell them. I doubt she had a law degree. Next day I bought them at either Menard's or Blain's Farm and Fleet.
  • WMno57
    WMno57 Member Posts: 205
    JUGHNE said:

    The tank in my shop still has the label.

    Quality Tanks Inc.
    608 Delco Drive
    Clinton WI
    53525

    608-676-2281

    Give that a try.
    Let us know.

    I found their website. This looks promising.

    http://www.qualitytanksinc.com/Expansion-Tanks.html

    Thank you
  • Jamie Hall
    Jamie Hall Member Posts: 17,006
    @WMno57 . Kindly read Matthew 7:3 - 7:5
    Br. Jamie, osb
    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England
    Larry Weingarten
  • WMno57
    WMno57 Member Posts: 205
    edited December 2020
    ...