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New boiler new header

Limey68Limey68 Member Posts: 5
Hi. My existing steam piping is all 2”, the replacement Peerless 63-04 states the Header single feed needs to be 2 1/2”. Is there any potential issue putting a 2 1/2” x 2” x 2 1/2” tee on the header to connect vertically to the existing 2” system?
Thanks in advance.

Comments

  • STEAM DOCTORSTEAM DOCTOR Member Posts: 1,174
    Fairly standard. The header size is often larger then the system piping.
  • Big Ed_4Big Ed_4 Member Posts: 1,383
    edited May 8
    The idea behind is to supply dry steam to the system , I would.

    PS , insulate the system piping... To supply dry steam to the radiators .

    I have enough experience to know , that I dont know it all
  • HVACNUTHVACNUT Member Posts: 3,468
    edited May 8
    Use both supplies and pipe them in 2".
  • STEAM DOCTORSTEAM DOCTOR Member Posts: 1,174
    edited May 8
    > @HVACNUT said:
    > Use both supplies and pipe them in 2".

    Header still needs to be 2.5"
  • HVACNUTHVACNUT Member Posts: 3,468
    > @STEAM DOCTOR said:
    > > @HVACNUT said:
    > > Use both supplies and pipe them in 2".
    >
    > Header still needs to be 2.5"


    Yes I meant that. The header should be per Peerless. I was suggesting using both risers in 2" instead of one riser in 2.5".
  • JUGHNEJUGHNE Member Posts: 7,059
    So your tee's would be 2 1/2 X 2 1/2 X 2........the 2" being the branch take off the side or top of the tee?
  • AMservicesAMservices Member Posts: 495
    Heres a couple of examples.
    Risers and header are all done in 2.5".





  • Big Ed_4Big Ed_4 Member Posts: 1,383
    Needs insulation to make it sing
    I have enough experience to know , that I dont know it all
  • Limey68Limey68 Member Posts: 5
    Looks like I’d be ok with the 2” tee connected to riser according to pics ie the top of the tee, 2 1/2” on header.
  • clammyclammy Member Posts: 2,513
    Usually on a 63-04 I would use both 3 riser into a 3 inch header and use a 3 x 2 for each system main. Even on a 63-03 I do a3 inch riser usually just a single riser boiler that small . The price difference is not huge and the bigger the risers and header the slower the exiting velocity and the slow the velocity the less carry over into the mains ,you want dry steam to be circulating in your mains ,dry steam equals more btu s and a lot less issues then trying to heat w wet steam . A steam boiler that does not have a properly sized or slightly over sized header will usually have issue which are usually only corrected in one of two ways . # 1 you pay to have it re piped properly or #2 you live w the issues and live w the cause and effect of a poor near boiler piping and either wait till the new boiler dies or you move I get a lot of the where moving and they live w issues and sell in the spring or summer . Just some food for thought , enter your zip and get a pro to replace your boiler . Replacing a steam boiler w the right contractor is more the just replacing the boiler ,it checking wet returns main and radiator vents and when all is done the proper cleaning of the boiler and system piping of any oils in both the boiler block and newly installed piping and the main thing is to make sure the boiler is sized properly for the connected edr of the radiators other wise you will have issues ,over sized steam boilers are like a plague and there usually not much you can do aside spend more money to down fire and or have a two stage gas valve . Chose wisely peace and good luck clammy
    R.A. Calmbacher L.L.C. HVAC
    NJ Master HVAC Lic.
    Mahwah, NJ
    Specializing in steam and hydronic heating
    kenlmad
  • HVACNUTHVACNUT Member Posts: 3,468
    @Limey68 , can you post some pics of the (soon to be) connected piping?

    The manual says you can go with one 2.5" riser, or two 2" risers. Either to a 2.5" header.

    That's minimum requirements.
  • dopey27177dopey27177 Member Posts: 361
    The Hartford loop is piped in much to high, This can cause boiler flooding and severe banging in both the boiler and header.

    The top of the Hartford loop should be piped in about 2" below the boilers standing water line or fill water line.

    As to the piping, this a wait and see item. If there are no problems, leave it alone. The as you know to change out is prohibitive if you are deciding to do this for the looks.

    Jake
  • AMservicesAMservices Member Posts: 495
    Gifford loop @dopey27177 .
    Works better then Hartford loop
    ChrisJ
  • Limey68Limey68 Member Posts: 5
    Hope pic makes sense. Single 2 1/2” header, any surge problem going from 2 1/2” to 2” on riser?
  • Limey68Limey68 Member Posts: 5
    Clammy, I got couple quotes for re-piping. Let’s just say they were outside my budget under current circumstances plus aside from snowing today it’s supposed to warm up.

    HVACNUT I went with single 2 1/2” header as in the installation guide. See pic, hope my question makes sense.
  • HVACNUTHVACNUT Member Posts: 3,468
    > @Limey68 said:
    > Clammy, I got couple quotes for re-piping. Let’s just say they were outside my budget under current circumstances plus aside from snowing today it’s supposed to warm up.
    >
    > HVACNUT I went with single 2 1/2” header as in the installation guide. See pic, hope my question makes sense.


    It's certainly by the book IMO.


    That being said, before you go further, some of the steam pros might be able to offer some piping guidance.
  • Dave0176Dave0176 Member Posts: 1,136
    Here’s how I did a 63-04 I used 2 2-1/2” risers and a three in header.



    DL Mechanical LLC Heating, Cooling and Plumbing 732-266-5386
    NJ Master HVACR Lic# 4630
    Specializing in Steam Heating, Serving the residents of New Jersey
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/dl-mechanical-llc

    https://m.facebook.com/DL-Mechanical-LLC-315309995326627/?ref=content_filter

    I cannot force people to spend money, I can only suggest how to spend it wisely.......
    SuperTech
  • clammyclammy Member Posts: 2,513
    I know it’s not just a me thing but if I’m going to use just one tapping I prefer to not reduce it but this is me . The only peerless I use a single 3 w a 3 inch header would be a 63 03 on a 04 it 2 3 inch riser into a 3 header and 05 06 it’s 2 3 inch riser into a 4 inch header . This is what I ve done for the past 20 years or more and it’s always worked perfect never a issue ,i stick to it cause it will never be cheaper the second time do over . And in doing it this way in 20 years I ve never had issue related to wet steam and all ways have had a happy customer ,I ve been called back to look at headers that I didn’t redo and some else did ( less money) and there where issue so don’t let price dictate who does the work . Remember that the header dimension the manafactures show are mim and if they stated header sizes that make that small steam chest produce dry steam and use larger pipe to reduce the exiting velocity down to below 15 FPS they wouldn’t be selling many boilers small pipes are cheaper so they star it that way so plumbers and heating companies won’t be deterred from using that manufactures Equipment ,small pipes are cheaper and easier to thread not everybody can cut and thread 2.5 pipe and above and larger fitting and tee are costly in comparison . Make your decision wisely you will be living w it a long time unless you ll pay for a second time . Just having a new boiler installed doesn’t mean it’s all new you should have all radiator vents and main vents changed and all near boiler piping and system piping should be insulated other wise it’s just a half a job and let’s not forget cleaning and skimming of the boiler to remove oils , if your system has wet return and they are original they should be flushed or replaced not sense in dumping 50 years of mud and rust into a new boiler . Wish you the best of luck being the winter over you should look at all options before you leap . Peace and good luck clammy
    R.A. Calmbacher L.L.C. HVAC
    NJ Master HVAC Lic.
    Mahwah, NJ
    Specializing in steam and hydronic heating
  • SteamheadSteamhead Member Posts: 13,929
    @Limey68 , how many steam mains are on that system? And what size are they? It looks like there are two dry returns, that's why I asked........................
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    "Reducing our country's energy consumption, one system at a time"
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Baltimore, MD (USA) and consulting anywhere.
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/all-steamed-up-inc
  • Limey68Limey68 Member Posts: 5
    > @Steamhead said:
    > @Limey68 , how many steam mains are on that system? And what size are they? It looks like there are two dry returns, that's why I asked........................
    One 2” feed, two 1 1/4” condensate returns. Original boiler was operational for 37 years and no problems at least as long as I’ve been here.
  • SteamheadSteamhead Member Posts: 13,929
    Then a single 2-1/2" riser and header would probably be enough. But @AMservices ' and @Dave0176 's pics are works of art, and you can't go wrong with them.
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    "Reducing our country's energy consumption, one system at a time"
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Baltimore, MD (USA) and consulting anywhere.
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/all-steamed-up-inc
    Hap_HazzardAMservices
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