Where to add wet return clean out?

JohnBeemer

I can't find a wet return clean out on this Columbia boiler. The manual shows a clean out tee near the hartford loop. I was thinking about removing the vertical capped copper pipe and adding a clean out at the bottom of the capped copper pipe shown in the attached picture and 7 seconds into the video. That pipe doesn't seem to be doing anything and it looks like the cap has leaked in the past.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1BRLI8T606XMbvYZbBjWv5KyVTqUul26V/view?usp=sharing

Cutting the copper near the floor with be a challenge since there's not enough clearance for a regular tube cutter. I guess I could use a hacksaw or a dremel tool. It also might be nearly impossible to sweat a fitting on the pipe since it will probably be full of wet sediment.

There may be enough clearance to get a shark-bite coupling on the pipe and then put a clean out faucet on the other side.

Any thoughts?

Thanks,

JB

mikeg2015

Not sure a shark bite can handle the water temps. During long runs it could be around 200F. I think the plastic seals are Limited to
180f.

Since it already on the floor maybe just install a ball valve type hose bib drain that’s at a right angle and a hose fitting, then you can hook up a small shop vac and suck it out for extra pressure.

Ball valves are full port. Gate valve boiler drain are usually not and tend to leak. But they are needed for pressure hit water system to prevent hammering from fast opening and closing.

If the wet future right before the boiler has an isolation valve, you could also add another hose drain and then pressure flush it. That’s the best method for cleaning.

JohnBeemer

There is no isolation valve near boilers wet return. I didn't realize the wet return would be close to 200F.

I've attached a picture where I can possible remove a union/coupling and use a shopvac to clean out.

I'm not sure what this vertical pipe is for. It starts small and then gets big at union and then back into the small return on the floor. Can that piping be replaced with a straight pipe?

The union in the picture is the only part of the wet return that can be opened without cutting open a pipe.

Any advice before I open the wet return at the coupling?

TIA

JB

acwagner

I would start small. Try putting on the wet return drain and see how that goes before opening everything up.

If there is no way to drain the wet return, keep in mind once you cut into it all the water is going to flow out with no obvious way to contain it. Hopefully there is floor drain nearby. From your video you have a decent length of wet return, so there will be a lot of water.

JohnBeemer

acwagner, I agree with you. That is why I was thinking about unscrewing the top of the coupling in the photos I posted. I can suck out any water that starts to flow out of the pipe with a shopvac. I can then unscrew the bottom coupling and suck out all the sediment.

Do you think that would work?

Once I suck out everything in the wet return, I can cut open the capped copper piece at the floor and install a wet return drain.

Any idea why someone would put that vertical big wet return pipe on the system? The photo is posted above.

Thanks for the reply.

JB

acwagner

It's hard to tell from these photos and photos from your other postings what is connected to what. Do you have a photo standing back from the boiler that shows how all this connects to the boiler?

JohnBeemer

Sorry, I'll post a lot of photos from different angles tomorrow.

Thanks,

JB

JohnBeemer

acwagner, here is a video on the boiler and some pics. Jamie, said I should have another riser instead of the port being capped. I'm guessing some of the other piping is wrong also.

The supply goes down out of the boiler instead of up to the header. Not sure how import this is but it doesn't seem right. The picture in the manual shows 2 risers going up to the header.

Here's a video of the boiler and piping.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1BRLI8T606XMbvYZbBjWv5KyVTqUul26V/view?usp=sharing

Do you think the piping should be redone?

acwagner

Probably the best thing is to start a new thread and solicit opinions on the best approach to fixing the near boiler piping. Include that video or a photo showing the near boiler piping. You'll get more traffic and better opinions than mine.

At a minimum, you want it to match the sizing and configuration shown in your boiler manual. Also, copper shouldn't be used for the steam supply coming out of the boiler--it won't hold up over time. Probably not a good project to take on in mid-October, unless you are hiring a steam pro.

Back to your wet return drain problem. That capped portion sticking up appears to be the end of the line, so that's a good location from that perspective. However, that's a tight corner and not easy to access, but I don't see a good simple alternative without redoing a lot of that piping.

I'd drain the boiler to below your hartford loop first. Then, you could try your shop vac idea with some sort of "straw" attachment that will allow you to suck the water out all the way down, so you don't have to cut the pipe with water in it and make a huge mess.

JohnBeemer

I think creating another post is a good idea. I'm sure the guy that did the piping didn't want to wrestle with black steel pipe on the supply.

I like the idea of using a straw with the shopvac to suck out the water. I piece of pvc might work.

I've read some other post where people snake the line out to break up the sediment. I could try that also but it would be difficult with all the 90 degree turns.

In the attached picture the pipe has a union and it gets larger and the smaller. Any idea why? I think I could unscrew the coupling and shopvac the wet return from there although I think the threads could strip since I see some rust.

Thanks,

JB

acwagner

That's a real Frankenstein of a connection. My guess is whoever did that had no idea what they were doing. Best case is it's acting as a drip, and worst case it's acting as your equalizer which would make it extremely undersized. Your boiler manual states it should be 1.5" or bigger.

I guess it depends on how big of a project you want to make it. Adding a wet return drain does need to happen. And, as @mikeg2015 said earlier, the best way to clean out the wet return is to have a connection at the other end of the wet return so you flush water through the whole length of the wet return.

JohnBeemer

Frankenstein connection is a good description. When you look at the boiler pipe manual picture above, it looks I could remove that sections of piping.

If you look at the video above, you'll notice that there's no hanger supports from the ceiling for the header. If I do remove that pipe, I would add a hanger support. That would be a lot of weight cantilevered over the boiler.

I may remove the copper cap and see what I can suck out. I'll think about re-piping everything in the spring.

Thanks for all your help,

JB