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Munchkin Replacement

Dan FoleyDan Foley Posts: 1,196Member
We replaced this 15 year old Munchkin boiler yesterday. It was at the far end of a 42” crawl space. At least it had a rat slab. We laid down a foam walkway to crawl on but it was still no fun.


  • Dan FoleyDan Foley Posts: 1,196Member
    We went back with an NTI LX because it is short, floor mounted and the controls are accessed through the front.

    We cleaned up the Pex piping as best we could. The 45 gal. Indirect was replaced with a 65 gal NTI. The owners complained of running out if DHW. This was the biggest tank that would fit in a tight closet.
  • Dan FoleyDan Foley Posts: 1,196Member
    The existing DHW tank did not have a T&P. Someone installed a black cap instead. It had pinholes and was leaking. There was not much metal left when we removed it. It was almost ready to let go.
  • RayWohlfarthRayWohlfarth Posts: 772Member
    @Dan Foley Nice looking job considering what you inherited You needed 4 foot tall installers
    Ray Wohlfarth
    Boiler Lessons
    Click here to take Ray's class.
    Click here to buy Ray's books.
  • HVACNUTHVACNUT Posts: 2,635Member
    Beautiful! Love the cabinet for the circs and zone board.
  • EBEBRATT-EdEBEBRATT-Ed Posts: 6,116Member
    I guess the original installer new the inspector (if he even got a permit) wasn't going in their.

    Nice job!!
  • Mike_SheppardMike_Sheppard Posts: 615Member
    Great job. Hope the customer understands the quality of work you gave them compared to what they had.
    Never stop learning.
  • Dan FoleyDan Foley Posts: 1,196Member

    The pump panel is by HPS Controls

    We used it to speed up the install. Field piping a pump panel in a tight crawl hole is not ideal.
  • JUGHNEJUGHNE Posts: 6,224Member
    Grand improvement.
    Who said that lipstick doesn't work. ;)

    We have all known home owners who do not want any equipment visible or do not want to lose closet space. Then in a few years they cry tears because no one wants to work on their stuff.
    They should be grateful to you for what you did....a good tip is in order I think.....bill accordingly.

    Isn't there any code that requires equipment as such to have a minimum ceiling height? Circuit breaker boxes need 6 or 6 1/2 feet of ceiling height. I learned this the hard way BTW.
  • IronmanIronman Posts: 5,310Member
    Beautiful work.
    I thought I was the only one that got to go behind those hack jobs in crawl spaces.
    Bob Boan

    You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
  • GroundUpGroundUp Posts: 673Member
    Awesome job you guys do! They sure are proud of those HPS panels $$$ but dang are they nice!
  • Solid_Fuel_ManSolid_Fuel_Man Posts: 1,760Member
    Crawling in a crawl space! Definatly a vast improvement, and nice to be able to press copper down there too.

    My BIL has a home on a similar crawl space with spaghetti PEX and a combi in it. I was tempted to shark bite it all!
    Serving Northern Maine HVAC, and Controls
  • Paul PolletsPaul Pollets Posts: 3,229Member
    Nice job in a difficult space. I'm always amazed by the poor workmanship in these types of jobs. Encouraging to see such good work!
  • archibald tuttlearchibald tuttle Posts: 645Member
    edited July 27
    Dan Foley said:

    The existing DHW tank did not have a T&P. Someone installed a black cap instead. It had pinholes and was leaking. There was not much metal left when we removed it. It was almost ready to let go.

    well a black cap with pinholes is kind of like a T&P . . . no? :D
  • ScottSecorScottSecor Posts: 330Member
    Beautiful job as usual Dan. You and your crew earned whatever money you made on this job. My knees hurt just thinking about that crawl space.

    Trying to stay positive here, whoever installed the Munchkin at least insulated the pex tubing. Just curious, did the Munchkin fail?
  • archibald tuttlearchibald tuttle Posts: 645Member
    edited July 28
    nice indeed. gotta love crawl spaces. and cpvc better than previous by a long shot albeit although still theoretically non-conforming by stack temp if you are running indirect hot water which is looking for 180 degree boiler water temp and has relatively hot return.

    when i go back to these jobs, if it is remotely possible, i'm switching to on demand condensing hot water to get the stack temps down in the boiler and in the water heater and working with emitters for as low a design temp as possible.

    I've had incredibly trouble free operation with the non-condensing on demands in place for like 15 years without trouble. Don't know if the condensing units will last as long but I'm stoked with stack temps all around.

    not criticizing, you play the hand you are dealt and left it way better than it was.

    I have found that the System 636 has the DWV style 90 in CPVC. It isn't really a sweep el as they claim, but it is by comparison to those those blunt standard CPVC turns - which i don't even like for pipe friction with fluid flow - although with the higher unit in the crawl space you might have been limited. i wish they would make the DWV pattern 45s in CPVC as well.

    Definitely like the crawl path! Save the knees for the next job.

  • Dave Yates (GrandPAH)Dave Yates (GrandPAH) Posts: 281Member
    Good grief! The before pics certainly illustrate what a nightmare your crew had to deal with. Outstanding completion!
  • hot_rodhot_rod Posts: 12,042Member
    Dan, a dual check, no vent accepted on the boiler fill?
    Certainly solves the dripping issue if code accepts it.
    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    The magic is in hydronics, and hydronics is in me
  • Dan FoleyDan Foley Posts: 1,196Member
    Hi HR,

    Technically thus would not pass code. 1. It is unlikely the inspector is going to crawl 30’ across this crawl space to check. 2. There is no floor drain. No one will notice the backflow is leaking until it floods the space.
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