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Single Pipe Steam Radiator - in need of a quiet vent solution

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jba20142016
jba20142016 Member Posts: 15
in Strictly Steam
Hello all. I am having an issue with a single pipe radiator. I live in a 50-unit apartment building that has a boiler heating system. I have a radiator in my bedroom and bathroom.



The problem is that the radiator steam vent in my bedroom makes a lound metal clank noise everytime steam is released (I am not referring to the clanking of radiator pipes, this is solely the vent). It appears to be a Hoffman vent that has some sort of springing contraption/mechanism inside of it that engages when it needs to release steam (video can be found here). The sound is similar to shooting a BB gun at an empty metal coffee can. It's very annoying because it happens sporadically and wakes me up in the middle of the night. The only solution I currently have is to close the radiator valve (which turns off the heat completely - obviously not an ideal solution). My landlord won't address the issue because the current vent works fine and keeps my apartment heated.



My question is, are there radiator vents that do not have this loud spring mechanism? If so, what are they? I am tempted to replace it myself.





Thanks
«1

Comments

  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
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    Yes, the newer Hoffman's tend to "click" each time they open and close. I think it is the concave metal bottom on the vents. It usually goes away after about a year but that's a long time to be aggravated. You can replace it with a Vent-Rite #1 which is quiet.
  • jba20142016
    jba20142016 Member Posts: 15
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    Fred said:

    Yes, the newer Hoffman's tend to "click" each time they open and close. I think it is the concave metal bottom on the vents. It usually goes away after about a year but that's a long time to be aggravated. You can replace it with a Vent-Rite #1 which is quiet.

    Thank you for the suggestion. Would you happen to have a suggested link/website to purchase this. When googling "vent-rite 1", I am getting numerous results and a bit overwhelmed.

    Thank you!
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 15,695
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    Gorton vents

    A G5 is a decent size for a typical radiator, but you may want slower (#4) or faster (#6, C, D) for your application.

    https://www.supplyhouse.com/Gorton-G5A-Gorton-No-5-Angle-Vapor-Equalizing-Valve-3528000-p


    These use a bimetal spring and operate silently.
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
    jba20142016
  • jba20142016
    jba20142016 Member Posts: 15
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    ChrisJ said:

    Gorton vents

    A G5 is a decent size for a typical radiator, but you may want slower (#4) or faster (#6, C, D) for your application.

    https://www.supplyhouse.com/Gorton-G5A-Gorton-No-5-Angle-Vapor-Equalizing-Valve-3528000-p


    These use a bimetal spring and operate silently.


    Thanks! sorry for the newbie question: what do you mean by "slower" or "faster"? What is the benefit of each?
  • ethicalpaul
    ethicalpaul Member Posts: 5,703
    edited December 2018
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    Welcome to the fold: https://heatinghelp.com/systems-help-center/balancing-one-pipe-steam-systems/

    Basically if that room is hotter than you'd like, get a slower vent. If you would like more heat, get a faster one
    NJ Steam Homeowner. See my sight glass boiler videos: https://bit.ly/3sZW1el
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 15,695
    edited December 2018
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    jba20142016 said:

    ChrisJ said:

    Gorton vents

    A G5 is a decent size for a typical radiator, but you may want slower (#4) or faster (#6, C, D) for your application.

    https://www.supplyhouse.com/Gorton-G5A-Gorton-No-5-Angle-Vapor-Equalizing-Valve-3528000-p


    These use a bimetal spring and operate silently.


    Thanks! sorry for the newbie question: what do you mean by "slower" or "faster"? What is the benefit of each?
    The speed it vents air from the radiator.
    The faster you vent it vs other ones, the more it will heat in a given time. It may warm the room up more. Slower should cool the room down overall.

    That's assuming you don't vent too fast for the system pressure of radiator type. If you vent too fast, it may actually cool the room some or cause knocking or spitting.

    A Gorton 5 is a safe size for most systems and is a good starting point. I believe it's also comparable to a Hoffman 40.

    If the room runs on the warm side and you'd like it cooler a G4 would be a good idea. But, a G4 is a lot slower than a G5 and will make a very noticeable difference.

    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • jba20142016
    jba20142016 Member Posts: 15
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    ethicalpaul said:

    Welcome to the fold: https://heatinghelp.com/systems-help-center/balancing-one-pipe-steam-systems/

    Basically if that room is hotter than you'd like, get a slower vent. If you would like more heat, get a faster one

    The problem with these guides is that I do not have access to the main vents. I live in a large apartment building. really just trying to make the vent in my apartment's radiator quiet.
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 15,695
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    jba20142016 said:

    ethicalpaul said:

    Welcome to the fold: https://heatinghelp.com/systems-help-center/balancing-one-pipe-steam-systems/

    Basically if that room is hotter than you'd like, get a slower vent. If you would like more heat, get a faster one

    The problem with these guides is that I do not have access to the main vents. I live in a large apartment building. really just trying to make the vent in my apartment's radiator quiet.
    Is your current vent a Hoffman 40?
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
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    @jba20142016 , order from here. The Vent-Rite is an excellent vent, that is adjustable so you don't have to buy a Gorton, find it vents too slow or too fast and then buy another one. With the Vent-Rite, you just change the number up or down. And the pricing is great from this site:
    https://ordering.fwwebb.com/woitem/496*1
  • jba20142016
    jba20142016 Member Posts: 15
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    ChrisJ said:

    jba20142016 said:

    ethicalpaul said:

    Welcome to the fold: https://heatinghelp.com/systems-help-center/balancing-one-pipe-steam-systems/

    Basically if that room is hotter than you'd like, get a slower vent. If you would like more heat, get a faster one

    The problem with these guides is that I do not have access to the main vents. I live in a large apartment building. really just trying to make the vent in my apartment's radiator quiet.
    Is your current vent a Hoffman 40?
    I am not sure, I believe it is a hoffman but I'm not sure what size/model.
  • jba20142016
    jba20142016 Member Posts: 15
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    Fred said:

    @jba20142016 , order from here. The Vent-Rite is an excellent vent, that is adjustable so you don't have to buy a Gorton, find it vents too slow or too fast and then buy another one. With the Vent-Rite, you just change the number up or down. And the pricing is great from this site:
    https://ordering.fwwebb.com/woitem/496*1

    Thanks! It appears that most of these vents tend to be 1/8"..is that a standard size?
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    edited December 2018
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    jba20142016 said:

    Fred said:

    @jba20142016 , order from here. The Vent-Rite is an excellent vent, that is adjustable so you don't have to buy a Gorton, find it vents too slow or too fast and then buy another one. With the Vent-Rite, you just change the number up or down. And the pricing is great from this site:
    https://ordering.fwwebb.com/woitem/496*1

    Thanks! It appears that most of these vents tend to be 1/8"..is that a standard size?
    Yes, the 1/8 vent tapping is the standard on radiators.
    jba20142016
  • jba20142016
    jba20142016 Member Posts: 15
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    @Fred
    And in your experience, the Vent-Rite does not have the loud clicking/clanking that the Hoffmans have?
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
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    jba20142016 said:

    @Fred
    And in your experience, the Vent-Rite does not have the loud clicking/clanking that the Hoffmans have?

    No it is silent. The hoffmans were to up until a few years ago when they either changed the design or went to a thinner metal shell. You'll like the Vent-Rite.
  • Chris_L
    Chris_L Member Posts: 336
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    jba20142016 said:

    @Fred
    And in your experience, the Vent-Rite does not have the loud clicking/clanking that the Hoffmans have?

    I like the adjustable Vent-Rite, but it does have a definite clink when it closes. It seems the higher (faster) the setting, the louder the clink.

    For that reason, I wouldn't use one in or near a bedroom. I think you are better off with a non-adjustable vent if quiet is your goal.

    I like Maid-O-Mists because you can adjust the venting speed by changing an orifice. Others prefer Gortons.

    I also have an old Hoffman 40, that gives a very gentle clink but seems to vent pretty slowly.

  • jba20142016
    jba20142016 Member Posts: 15
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    @Chris_L

    Thanks for the insight. do you have a specific model/link for the maid-o-mist. And does the maid-o-mist have a "clinking" mechanism?

    Also, how does the loudness of the clinking for the vent-rite compare to the hoffmans?
  • Gordo
    Gordo Member Posts: 857
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    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ugIrg9bquk

    The above is a YouTube video showing what's inside a Gorton, etc.

    There are other videos on my site showing what's inside a Hoffman #40, a Hoffman #1A and so forth.

    I hope you find this information useful, If so, please like, comment, and subscribe. The opinions expressed in the above videos are my own, and do not necessarily reflect what others may believe.
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    "Reducing our country's energy consumption, one system at a time"
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Baltimore, MD (USA) and consulting anywhere.
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/all-steamed-up-inc
  • Chris_L
    Chris_L Member Posts: 336
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    @jba20142016
    See @Gordo's excellent video on the way the different vents work.

    You can get Maid-O-Mists vents (and many others) here:
    https://www.supplyhouse.com/Jacobus

    I don't have any experience with the newer, non-adjustable Hoffmans. I can tell you I live downstairs from my tenants who have an adjustable Vent-Rite in the living room. I can hear it in my living room and in the adjacent room beneath it.

    I made the mistake of putting an adjustable Vent-Rite in the bedroom directly above mine. That one is going to change--to an old, fixed Hoffman if I have one hanging around.
    Gordo
  • gfrbrookline
    gfrbrookline Member Posts: 753
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    You can get the ventrite from www.patriot-supply.com. I have been using them for years and have not really notices a click. I like the adjustability over the Gorton's and the Gorton's make a wheezing sound that I find annoying. The Hoffman's definately click but they tame with time assuming your pressure is set correctly.
  • Gsmith
    Gsmith Member Posts: 432
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    I have vent-rite adjustables in 4 bedrooms, never hear them at all.
  • gfrbrookline
    gfrbrookline Member Posts: 753
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    My heat just ran a cycle, listened to my Ventrite #1 in the living room, definitely didn't click, nice an quiet.
  • gfrbrookline
    gfrbrookline Member Posts: 753
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    If you are in the Boston area Republic Plumbing has them in stock as well.
  • ethicalpaul
    ethicalpaul Member Posts: 5,703
    edited December 2018
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    > @jba20142016 said:
    > Welcome to the fold: https://heatinghelp.com/systems-help-center/balancing-one-pipe-steam-systems/
    >
    > Basically if that room is hotter than you'd like, get a slower vent. If you would like more heat, get a faster one
    >
    > The problem with these guides is that I do not have access to the main vents. I live in a large apartment building. really just trying to make the vent in my apartment's radiator quiet.

    Yes but there’s good info about radiator venting in there, and also by knowing how the steam gets to your radiators you are better equipped to do what you can to help from your apartment
    NJ Steam Homeowner. See my sight glass boiler videos: https://bit.ly/3sZW1el
  • jba20142016
    jba20142016 Member Posts: 15
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    Chris_L said:

    @jba20142016
    See @Gordo's excellent video on the way the different vents work.

    You can get Maid-O-Mists vents (and many others) here:
    https://www.supplyhouse.com/Jacobus

    I don't have any experience with the newer, non-adjustable Hoffmans. I can tell you I live downstairs from my tenants who have an adjustable Vent-Rite in the living room. I can hear it in my living room and in the adjacent room beneath it.

    I made the mistake of putting an adjustable Vent-Rite in the bedroom directly above mine. That one is going to change--to an old, fixed Hoffman if I have one hanging around.

    Thanks, @Chris_L ! Do you suggest the #67 "auto", or #40? My priority here is to have not metallic clicking/clanking.
  • Chris_L
    Chris_L Member Posts: 336
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    Don't get the 67. It is for water, not steam.

    You can get the 40, which looks a lot like a Hoffman 40, or any of what they call "angle air valves".
  • ImYoungxD
    ImYoungxD Member Posts: 130
    edited December 2018
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    I think the Maid O mist makes whistle noise when the boiler is turned off. I suggest you look on eBay as well since many of them don't charge shipping cost. Price may be low as well.
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 15,695
    edited December 2018
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    ImYoungxD said:

    I think the Maid O mist makes whistle noise when the boiler is turned off. I suggest you look on eBay as well since many of them don't charge shipping cost. Price may be low as well.

    I believe that's system dependent and isn't effected by the type of vent.
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • jba20142016
    jba20142016 Member Posts: 15
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    Chris_L said:

    Don't get the 67. It is for water, not steam.

    You can get the 40, which looks a lot like a Hoffman 40, or any of what they call "angle air valves".

    @Chris_L ok thanks. And sorry again for the newb question, but what is the difference between an "air valve" and "steam vent"?The maid-o-mist 40 looks like a hoffman, is it safe to assume it uses a similar sprining contraption that would be just as loud as hoffman?
  • JimmyNJ
    JimmyNJ Member Posts: 107
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    Agree with Fred - Vent-rite is the way to go for the ability to adjust the heating to your liking without buying/trying several different vent sizes. I have several of these and they do not have any clicking sounds at all - very quiet in my experience and a good quality vent.
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    edited December 2018
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    JimmyNJ said:

    Agree with Fred - Vent-rite is the way to go for the ability to adjust the heating to your liking without buying/trying several different vent sizes. I have several of these and they do not have any clicking sounds at all - very quiet in my experience and a good quality vent.

    You can give people good advice. Sometimes they take it, sometimes they don't. It's their call but one would think there are enough affirmations in this string that the Vent-Rite is the best solution, for a couple reasons, the Poster would say "Thank You" and order it up. At the end of the day, they will be posting again to say the room is either too hot or too cold because they bought the wrong fixed port vent and they will have to buy another one, maybe then it will be a silent Vent-Rite.
  • jba20142016
    jba20142016 Member Posts: 15
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    Fred said:

    JimmyNJ said:

    Agree with Fred - Vent-rite is the way to go for the ability to adjust the heating to your liking without buying/trying several different vent sizes. I have several of these and they do not have any clicking sounds at all - very quiet in my experience and a good quality vent.

    You can give people good advice. Sometimes they take it, sometimes they don't. It's their call but one would think there are enough affirmations in this string that the Vent-Rite is the best solution, for a couple reasons, the Poster would say "Thank You" and order it up. At the end of the day, they will be posting again to say the room is either too hot or too cold because they bought the wrong fixed port vent and they will have to buy another one, maybe then it will be a silent Vent-Rite.
    I do appreciate the advice and am leaning towards the Vent-rite. My goal is to nail down the pricing of both the vent-rite (cheapest i can find is $30 on amazon) and the maid-o-mist ($10 at the supplyhouse website the other poster linked) then re-read these comments to determine which would be the least risky-purchase. Multiple posters have said that vent-rites have the metallic clicking, many others have said they are silent. I hope you can understand it's hard to come to a concensus. I certainly appreciate everyone's input.
  • Gsmith
    Gsmith Member Posts: 432
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    Try one of each, worst you risk is $30. Sometimes you can over analyze.
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 15,695
    edited December 2018
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    Fred said:

    JimmyNJ said:

    Agree with Fred - Vent-rite is the way to go for the ability to adjust the heating to your liking without buying/trying several different vent sizes. I have several of these and they do not have any clicking sounds at all - very quiet in my experience and a good quality vent.

    You can give people good advice. Sometimes they take it, sometimes they don't. It's their call but one would think there are enough affirmations in this string that the Vent-Rite is the best solution, for a couple reasons, the Poster would say "Thank You" and order it up. At the end of the day, they will be posting again to say the room is either too hot or too cold because they bought the wrong fixed port vent and they will have to buy another one, maybe then it will be a silent Vent-Rite.
    It's good advice, I'll agree with that.
    But I disagree that the Vent-Rite is "the best vent".

    I think my Macon TRVs came with fixed Vent-Rites, but I could be wrong. So far, I have no complaints about them. But, I still prefer the way a Gorton functions. Also, to be fair, steam has never reached any of my Macon TRVs yet. So I have no idea if they make noise.

    Everyone gave their opinions and it's up to the OP to decide which route they want to go. There's no reason or need to insult them.

    Happy Holidays Fred.
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
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    @ChrisJ , my comment was in no way an insult. It is simply a fact. Sometimes people take good advice, sometimes they don't. It's that simple. I wish you and your family the happiest of Holidays and the best life has to offer in the upcoming year!
  • Chris_L
    Chris_L Member Posts: 336
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    @ChrisJ said:
    Also, to be fair, steam has never reached any of my Macon TRVs yet. So I have no idea if they make noise.

    This is really key. All of my vents are silent--until the steam hits them. And that is when I hear the adjustable Vent-Rite clink.

    I don't doubt people have adjustable Vent-Rites they can't hear. But I wonder how often those vents see steam, and how open they are set. (And the OP's link shows his vent is definitely seeing steam.)
  • jba20142016
    jba20142016 Member Posts: 15
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    Chris_L said:

    @ChrisJ said:

    Also, to be fair, steam has never reached any of my Macon TRVs yet. So I have no idea if they make noise.

    This is really key. All of my vents are silent--until the steam hits them. And that is when I hear the adjustable Vent-Rite clink.

    I don't doubt people have adjustable Vent-Rites they can't hear. But I wonder how often those vents see steam, and how open they are set. (And the OP's link shows his vent is definitely seeing steam.)
    @Chris_L For what it's worth, my radiator gets A LOT of steam, high pressure. Should this be accounted for when choosing between an "air valve" and "steam vent" in the link you had sent me?
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 15,695
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    A Gorton vent cannot click due to it's design. It's physically impossible.

    The Vent-Rite is the same design as a Hoffman. It has a metal bottom on a capsule that "oil cans" in and out to open and close the vent. I believe Fred when he says the ones he has are quiet. But are they all?
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    edited December 2018
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    ChrisJ said:

    A Gorton vent cannot click due to it's design. It's physically impossible.

    The Vent-Rite is the same design as a Hoffman. It has a metal bottom on a capsule that "oil cans" in and out to open and close the vent. I believe Fred when he says the ones he has are quiet. But are they all?

    Mine are all dead silent, everyone of them. As I said earlier, I had a newer one that clicked but it too is now silent. The vent right capsule is not the same design as the Hoffman. The dial is on the bottom and that breaks the bottom surface of the vent that pops in and out on the Hoffmans.
  • Mark N
    Mark N Member Posts: 1,115
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    @Gordo have you ever cut open a Vent-Rite adjustable vent?
  • Chris_L
    Chris_L Member Posts: 336
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    @jba20142016 Don't get caught up in the terminology. In this context, "steam vent" "air valve" do the same thing.

    In looking at your video, it looks like you have a Hoffman 1A, which is adjustable. I'd start by putting it on the slowest setting (loosen the top nut and turn the ring below to a slow setting). See how that affects the noise and the room temp. If it is warm enough, the slower the better.

    Even if it is still too noisy for you, this will at least give you some indication of how fast a non-adjustable vent should be if you go that route.

    As you can see, some, like @ChrisJ and me, like vents with a bimetal strip. (Watch @Gordo's video.) Others like the "oil can" design.

    Everyone has their favorites.

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