Ready to switch out 2 Buderus Oil for Lochinvar KHN, HTP, or WM Evergreen

acaciolo

After 15 years with these 2 Buderus G115 Oil Boilers, I am finally ready to switch to propane. The annual maintenance and headaches with the lack of skilled Riello techs in my area is killing me. I am a custom home builder and I need to show off in my personal house what I am going to use in all of our customer homes. www.monogramcustombuilders.com is my company.

Anyway, I've attached a rough summary of my system. 240kbtu gross output boilers now with a combo of 6 hotwater radiator/baseboard zone, 1 air coil, and 5 radiant zones. There is a total of 16,000 sf in this 4 story house, but the basement (and room below the basement) has a very limited heat load. The above grade 8000sf is where the real demand is. Lots and lots of high ceilings and windows. An argument could be made to go bigger or smaller, but based on the old heat loss calculations, around 240k seems to be the best choice and gives me a little room for when we need to heat the massive basement and sub basement.

For boilers, I like Lochinvar khn(l) 285 or HTP. My local hvac tech likes the WM evergreen 299 and they are heavily used around here. The risk with HTP or Lochinvar is that there isn't a strong service presence (kinda like what I deal with on my Riello burners now.)

The system is currently set up on taco control panels which we will reuse.

The question is whether a mod con boiler like this is right for me and whether I should use a buffer tank because of my wildly varying load demands (from dhw only to the entire house.)

thanks in advance!
tony c.

NY_Rob

Unless you're willing to take the responsibility of "no heat" for extended periods... go with the brand that has robust local support.

Ironman

My take on it is this: if they can't work on a Riello, they can't do a Becket either; there's not THAT much difference.

The same goes for a mod/con: if they can't work on a Loch or an HTP, then I wouldn't let 'em touch an Evergreen.

Personally, I'd look at using two mod/cons with a 10 to 1 turndown on each. That will give you a 20 to 1 between both which may eliminate the need for a buffer tank.

It would really be best if you could get a good pro from here on site.

@Harvey Ramer is in Chambersburg and
@STEVEusaPA is somewhere between Philly and Allentown.

hot_rod

Or a hybrid with one mod con for low load, low temperature days, and a cast irons stage two.

acaciolo

thanks for the info. that room was barely designed for 1 boiler, then an addition caused us to have to squeeze in another. So I am hoping to stick with 1 boiler. a 10:1 240k output should work, as very rarely is only 1 small zone calling for heat. I will look at doing 2, but I think 1 is the best. I agree on riello vs. beckett...but this is an "old fashioned" town and many of the contractors are stuck in their old ways.

Robert O'Brien

I can't resist this but 16,000 square feet and a tiny boiler room?

EBEBRATT-Ed

Why not just but a gas burner in the Buderus?? Maybe the locals can't work on that either.

This is and will become a "uge" issue in the future. Lack of qualified technicians.

You can have the best equipment in the world but with no one who can work on it it will soon fail.

We can't even get installers to read the boiler install manual.

A good technician can figure out any boiler. No.......maybe not immediately. It's a little uncomfortable to work on something you have never seen before...I and may others here I am sure have done that.

I have always looked at it as a challenge

Ironman

I don't understand how you could have two G115's and not fit two mod/cons back in their place. All of the boilers that you mentioned are available in floor mount or wall.

acaciolo

Robert O'Brien said:

I can't resist this but 16,000 square feet and a tiny boiler room?

true dat. It was a decent sized room until the addition happened and we squeezed in a 2nd boiler. that made it very very cramped!

Steamhead

EBEBRATT-Ed said:

Why not just but a gas burner in the Buderus??

My question exactly. They run real nice with Carlin gas burners.

BobC

If a mod con is properly sized, properly installed and correctly maintained they can save fuel. If any of those three isn't done it will not save fuel and may not run at all.

The old cast iron boat anchors may not run at peak efficiency but even an idiot like me can keep them running without much trouble and if the owner wants to he can tell how it should be installed with just a perfunctory look at the manual.

With the lack of qualified service people I'm not convinced of the savings to be had with a modcon over cast iron OVER 25 years or so, not to mention getting it fixed once the installer is out of the picture. Maybe keeping it simple isn't a bad policy.

In any case, whatever you choose to install must be something the locals are used to servicing - otherwise your throwing money away.

Bob

EBEBRATT-Ed

Boy, @BobC , I think you nailed that. Putting in anything that can't or won't get serviced is just a waste. Keeping it simple gives it a chance.

My old man used to say "Buy a Chevy or a Ford, they can fix it the corner garage"

Not bad advise sometimes