Click here to Find a Contractor in your area.
Welcome! Here are the website rules, as well as some tips for using this forum.
Need to contact us? Visit https://heatinghelp.com/contact-us/.

Ready to switch out 2 Buderus Oil for Lochinvar KHN, HTP, or WM Evergreen

acaciolo
acaciolo Member Posts: 12
After 15 years with these 2 Buderus G115 Oil Boilers, I am finally ready to switch to propane. The annual maintenance and headaches with the lack of skilled Riello techs in my area is killing me. I am a custom home builder and I need to show off in my personal house what I am going to use in all of our customer homes. www.monogramcustombuilders.com is my company.

Anyway, I've attached a rough summary of my system. 240kbtu gross output boilers now with a combo of 6 hotwater radiator/baseboard zone, 1 air coil, and 5 radiant zones. There is a total of 16,000 sf in this 4 story house, but the basement (and room below the basement) has a very limited heat load. The above grade 8000sf is where the real demand is. Lots and lots of high ceilings and windows. An argument could be made to go bigger or smaller, but based on the old heat loss calculations, around 240k seems to be the best choice and gives me a little room for when we need to heat the massive basement and sub basement.

For boilers, I like Lochinvar khn(l) 285 or HTP. My local hvac tech likes the WM evergreen 299 and they are heavily used around here. The risk with HTP or Lochinvar is that there isn't a strong service presence (kinda like what I deal with on my Riello burners now.)

The system is currently set up on taco control panels which we will reuse.

The question is whether a mod con boiler like this is right for me and whether I should use a buffer tank because of my wildly varying load demands (from dhw only to the entire house.)

thanks in advance!
tony c.

Comments

  • NY_Rob
    NY_Rob Member Posts: 1,370
    Unless you're willing to take the responsibility of "no heat" for extended periods... go with the brand that has robust local support.
    delta T
  • Ironman
    Ironman Member Posts: 6,581
    My take on it is this: if they can't work on a Riello, they can't do a Becket either; there's not THAT much difference.

    The same goes for a mod/con: if they can't work on a Loch or an HTP, then I wouldn't let 'em touch an Evergreen.

    Personally, I'd look at using two mod/cons with a 10 to 1 turndown on each. That will give you a 20 to 1 between both which may eliminate the need for a buffer tank.

    It would really be best if you could get a good pro from here on site.

    @Harvey Ramer is in Chambersburg and
    @STEVEusaPA is somewhere between Philly and Allentown.
    Bob Boan
    You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
    GordySolid_Fuel_Mandelta T
  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 15,049
    Or a hybrid with one mod con for low load, low temperature days, and a cast irons stage two.
    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
    Gordy
  • acaciolo
    acaciolo Member Posts: 12
    thanks for the info. that room was barely designed for 1 boiler, then an addition caused us to have to squeeze in another. So I am hoping to stick with 1 boiler. a 10:1 240k output should work, as very rarely is only 1 small zone calling for heat. I will look at doing 2, but I think 1 is the best. I agree on riello vs. beckett...but this is an "old fashioned" town and many of the contractors are stuck in their old ways.
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 10,342
    Why not just but a gas burner in the Buderus?? Maybe the locals can't work on that either.

    This is and will become a "uge" issue in the future. Lack of qualified technicians.

    You can have the best equipment in the world but with no one who can work on it it will soon fail.

    We can't even get installers to read the boiler install manual.

    A good technician can figure out any boiler. No.......maybe not immediately. It's a little uncomfortable to work on something you have never seen before...I and may others here I am sure have done that.

    I have always looked at it as a challenge
    IronmanacacioloCanuckerdelta T
  • Ironman
    Ironman Member Posts: 6,581
    I don't understand how you could have two G115's and not fit two mod/cons back in their place. All of the boilers that you mentioned are available in floor mount or wall.
    Bob Boan
    You can choose to do what you want, but you cannot choose the consequences.
    delta Trick in Alaska
  • acaciolo
    acaciolo Member Posts: 12

    I can't resist this but 16,000 square feet and a tiny boiler room? :)

    true dat. It was a decent sized room until the addition happened and we squeezed in a 2nd boiler. that made it very very cramped!
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 14,850

    Why not just but a gas burner in the Buderus??

    My question exactly. They run real nice with Carlin gas burners.
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • BobC
    BobC Member Posts: 5,231
    If a mod con is properly sized, properly installed and correctly maintained they can save fuel. If any of those three isn't done it will not save fuel and may not run at all.

    The old cast iron boat anchors may not run at peak efficiency but even an idiot like me can keep them running without much trouble and if the owner wants to he can tell how it should be installed with just a perfunctory look at the manual.

    With the lack of qualified service people I'm not convinced of the savings to be had with a modcon over cast iron OVER 25 years or so, not to mention getting it fixed once the installer is out of the picture. Maybe keeping it simple isn't a bad policy.

    In any case, whatever you choose to install must be something the locals are used to servicing - otherwise your throwing money away.

    Bob
    Smith G8-3 with EZ Gas @ 90,000 BTU, Single pipe steam
    Vaporstat with a 12oz cut-out and 4oz cut-in
    3PSI gauge
    NY_RobGordyacaciolo
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 10,342
    Boy, @BobC , I think you nailed that. Putting in anything that can't or won't get serviced is just a waste. Keeping it simple gives it a chance.

    My old man used to say "Buy a Chevy or a Ford, they can fix it the corner garage"

    Not bad advise sometimes
    acaciolo