how to replace actuator on wisbro manifold ?

seandarcy

I got two bathrooms with radiant heat supplied by a 10-year old Wisbro manifold. One bath is getting some heat, the other is getting none. Since there's hot water to the manifold, my best guess is that the actuators are the problem.

I've gotten the uponor A3023522 thermal actuator, which seems to be the successor model to the existing actuators. I've also gotten a VA33 to connect to the brass manifold.

How do I actually replace the actuators ? Do I need to drain the loop ? Also, the actuators are on the bottom of the manifold, the return lines on the top. All the literature I've seen has the actuator on the top. Does this matter ?

thanks,
sean

Zman

The valves should just unscrew from the base. No water to worry about.
The wiring should be the same as the old one.
Upside down should not effect operation.

rick in Alaska

Depends if the thermal actuator is bad, or the operating stem under it. If you watch the operation of the actuator when it is open, it should have a color band sticking up above it. Usually takes 2-3 minutes to get to that point. The best way I know of to check the stem is to take the actuator off by squeezing around the base and pulling it off, then checking the stem by pushing down on the plunger. The plunger should move up and down freely. If you have to change out the stem, you will need to close down any valves feeding the manifold. Then just unscrew the stem and put in a new one.
Rick

Mark Eatherton

They want the operator on top of the manifold to avoid the possibility of water leaking directly into the ZV motor. If you have no leaks, it shouldn't be a problem.

ME

seandarcy

Thanks for all your quick responses.

And now, the uponor instruction sheet says :

Thehe actuator is shipped locked partially open. To unlock, apply power for a minimum of six minutes. Failure to do so will allow flow through the loops.

So if I don't apply power, I'll get flow regardless of the thermostat ? And what does apply power mean ? Just hook up the four wires ?

Dave H_2

After you hook up the wires, turn the heat up in those rooms. This will energize the actuators. Leave on for at least 10 minutes, then you can turn the thermostat setting back down to your desired level.

Now there have been several styles of actuators over the years so there are different mounting options. Can you send a pic along of your existing actuators on the manifold?

Dave H.

hot_rod

Check the stem when you replace actuators.
First for any signs of leak or seeping around the o-rings.

Also that the stem can be pushed in easily. Once they start to seize up, they can destroy the actuators.

My rule of thumb is to use my thumb nail and push the stem.

If it puts a hole through the your nail and doesn't open, replace the stem assembly

Agree with Dave, the various vintages of actuators do not always interchange, even if the thread is the same. It has to do with the pin stroke dimension.

seandarcy

Yes, I do need to place the manifold valves themselves. In the image the valve on the left was never used. The other two had actuators attached. Those two have stems that haven't seized, but are more difficult to move.



I'm thinking of using this valve:

http://www.supplyhouse.com/Wirsbo-Uponor-A2620017-TruFLOW-Replacement-Manifold-Valve

I assume I unscrew the existing valve and replace it with the new one. The manifold has no close-off valves. I can close off the supply and the return to the manifold at the boiler. Is that enough to avoid flooding?

seandarcy

The uponor description of the manifold:

The TruFLOW manifold comes
with black plastic caps mounted
on the return manifold for manual
operation of the on/off valves.

How would you use the black plastic caps to open the valve ? I thought these where piston valves. That is, when the piston was in the valve was closed. So the actuators closed the valve by pushing on the stem. When the stem was out the valve was open. And how would you adjust the stem using the plastic cap ??

hot_rod

when you screw on an electric actuator it pushed the valve closed, when it powers up the piston in the actuator retracts, the pin in the manifold backs out, to allow flow.

See the stem pic I posted above. As I push the pin in, the valve closes.

If you remove an actuator the port is full open.

The plastic cap allows you to push the pin down and close off the port, just as the actuator does when not powered.

The center of the three in your picture appears to have an adapter ring for the actuator to mount on.

Dave H_2

If you have actuators on the manifolds, the black plastic caps have been removed. It is a two-piece design threading onto the manifold then turning the cap to open and close the valve.

Dave H.

seandarcy

Supply House says:

Unfortunately the SKU: A2620017 you selected does not work for the older brass Wirsbo manifold. The is for the newer Uponor tru-flow manifolds. All parts for the older Wirsbo manifold are obsolete. If you wish to replace the valves you will need to replace the entire manifold at this time.

So I've got to replace the entire manifold. Definitely not DIY !

cooper185

I finally got the A2620017 TruFLOW Replacement Manifold Valve for the newer (Installed in 2008) Uponor manifold. Of course, there's no leak when removing/replacing the actuator. But I've got a similar question from Sean Darcy's 2017 post above, although with a small difference. I can close off the supply and the return to the manifold at the manifold itself. Is that enough to avoid flooding when I remove the old valve and replace it with the A2620017?

You can see pictures of my manifold here.

GGross

@cooper185
Should note that there is an adapter ring for attaching new actuators to older style manifolds, it is marked on the adapter ring "VA33" there are several adapter rings available and they mostly look similar. To the best of my knowledge if the manifold says "UPONOR" it should be a new Truflow manifold.

The adapter ring for the old style manifolds is this part number, for anyone else that comes across this post
A3019900 will have "VA33" printed on it

cooper185

@GGross
I've gotten the adapters for all of the newer actuators when I installed them years ago. They're not A3019900 VA33 adapters for the older Wirsbo manifold. My adapters from thermal actuators (4-wire A3023522) to a 5-zone/port Uponor manifold are VA31H adapters.

cooper185

I'd still like to know as Sean Darcy asked in his 2017 post above, if there might be a LOT of water leakage when I, like Sean, remove the old valve and change it with a new replacement valve. Unlike Sean, I can close off the supply and the return on the manifold itself. The new valve should seal any water leak when it's seated. I'm just concerned (even if the valve replacement is done very quickly) about any amount of water that may spill from my system, and whether a small amount would be a concern. There wasn't any clear answer when Sean asked the same question. Any opinions would be appreciated. Both the inlet and outlet water will only be around 70° F. when I do this valve swap.

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

If the valves at the manifold don't leak, you will have very little water leakage when replace the pin valves. Pressure will drop to zero very quickly. Just have a couple of dry towels at the ready to pick up a few drips.

At least, that's what happens here on the West Coast. YMMV : )

cooper185

@Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

That's wonderful to hear! I was a bit nervous about this, and now I'm ready to do this tomorrow. Thanks!

😂8.33 lbs./gal. x 60 min./hr. x 20°ΔT = 10,000 BTU's/hourTwo btu/ per sq ft for degree difference for a slab🤣Have to see if those units conversion work out 👀

Will post here soon as to the results.

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

@cooper185 Yeah, that's a run-on sentence, alright. I think I just figured out how to separate them; couldn't manage to do it before.

cooper185

Nice signature. Appropriate for this forum.

cooper185

All that was lost when replacing the manifold valve today was my anxiety and about 1/2 cup of water on the basement floor. When reopening numerous shutoff ball valves, there was an extremely brief flow of makeup water from my Watts 1156F city pressure to boiler valve.