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GB-142 and lack of radiation

Dave_22
Dave_22 Member Posts: 232
Hello all. I have a GB-142, RC-10 room controller and panel radiators with TRV's. After having trouble maintaining temp in the room with the thermostat, I ran some heatloss software and it appears the room is under radiated a bit. I probably will add another panel rad sometime. My main question is- Could this cause high gas usage as the boiler rarely shuts off? Thanks.

Comments

  • Jamie Hall
    Jamie Hall Member Posts: 23,170
    Well, yes -- if you manage to raise the temperature in a space, it will lose more heat to outside. Therefore, to maintain the temperature you will have to add more heat. Gas. Just adding another panel rad won't make much difference, if any. But if you raise the temperature... There is no free lunch.
    Br. Jamie, osb
    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England
  • Dave_22
    Dave_22 Member Posts: 232
    Thanks. I guess I was really wondering if the "lack" of radiation now could cause high gas usage because the boiler never shuts off. I understand adding another radiator would cause the boiler to run harder because the return water temp would be less, but, if it reaches setpoint and shuts off, is that better in the long run for fuel usage?
  • GW
    GW Member Posts: 4,691
    Dave your question delves into the USA vs European strategies

    Heat = BTU/fuel burned = dollars spent, best of luck tying to side step that rule.

    Adding heat to a room requires more $ for the fuel.

    If the room where the controller is has a lack of BTU you're chasing your tail a bit

    Your boiler is working hard to satisfy the RC.

    I hope you do not have a TRV head on a radiator where the RC is

    If you add radiators yes that is a good thing, the boiler will operate at lower temperatures which increases efficiency. Of course that all costs money

    Sounds like we are having two subjects discussed at the same time

    Gary
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    gary@wilsonph.com
  • Dave_22
    Dave_22 Member Posts: 232
    Thanks GW. I guess this all started for 2 reasons. The 1st being that I thought I was using a lot of propane for having fairly decent 2x6" construction and a high efficiency system. The 2nd reason was noticing when it got cold that it couldn't maintain the setpoint. To answer your one question--No, there isn't a TRV in the room with the RC controller. I really wish there was a better controller that didn't cost an arm and a leg. I'd love to know what my boiler firing rate is and have a little more feedback than what the RC offers.
  • GW
    GW Member Posts: 4,691
    If rad is small you see like you know the answer to your question. You have good gpm? Your combustion is good? Your heat exchanger is clean? Your house isn't losing excessive heat? Something doesn't seem to add up
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    gary@wilsonph.com
  • Dave_22
    Dave_22 Member Posts: 232
    I'll have to check the flow setters for the GPM. Combustion was set up in beginning. I clean the HX once a year although I'm not super fond of the aluminum HX and the the build up it gets. I try to clean it as good as possible. No changes in house structure. It's pretty much operated like this since it was installed in 09.
  • GW
    GW Member Posts: 4,691
    You using mineral oil? Hx should be pretty clean. Aluminum has good heat transfer
    Back in Earlier years it used less fuel?
    I'd recommend getting the combustion analyzer back on it to confirm your co2 and your offset with your manometer
    I'd recommend getting the water conditiones.
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    gary@wilsonph.com
    kcopp
  • Dave_22
    Dave_22 Member Posts: 232
    I haven't used mineral oil. It's always seemed to use a lot of fuel. I just downloaded the instructions for using mineral oil- I'll give it a try. Thank you for your suggestions.
  • Mad Dog_2
    Mad Dog_2 Member Posts: 6,832
    Gary has solid suggestions. So? Do u have a TTV on the rad in room with RC 10? Mad Dog
  • GW
    GW Member Posts: 4,691
    Mad dog he says no
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    gary@wilsonph.com
  • Dave_22
    Dave_22 Member Posts: 232
    Mad Dog said:

    Gary has solid suggestions. So? Do u have a TTV on the rad in room with RC 10? Mad Dog

    No, I do not.
  • Mad Dog_2
    Mad Dog_2 Member Posts: 6,832
    The 64,000 dollar question is....What are you comparing the gas usage to? What is high? Mad Dog
    lchmb
  • Dave_22
    Dave_22 Member Posts: 232
    I can't compare it to anything because there was no system in when I bought the house-Just a pellet stove and electric baseboard. Propane between $300-400/mo in the winter.
  • Dave_22
    Dave_22 Member Posts: 232

    Dave said:

    I can't compare it to anything because there was no system in when I bought the house-Just a pellet stove and electric baseboard. Propane between $300-400/mo in the winter.

    What did you get when you did the heatloss for the house?
    Don't exactly recall but believe 68-70,000
    What's the closest airport? Buffalo,NY

    Is that $350/month in a typical January (not last year)? Yes

    What's the estimated hot water use per day (count the number of showers and the time for each). 2 showers, 5-7 minutes each

    What's the price for propane?
    Right now at $1.79 which is very reasonable. It got up to$3.50 a few years back. Went through 208 gallons from Oct 8th to Dec 8th. Not bad, but it wasn't that cold.

  • Dave_22
    Dave_22 Member Posts: 232
    I don't have the #'s with me but I think I was going through around 1,200- 1,400 gallons per heating season.
  • GW
    GW Member Posts: 4,691
    Any Icicles off the roof?
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    gary@wilsonph.com
  • Dave_22
    Dave_22 Member Posts: 232
    Yes sir. All vaulted ceilings, some skylights and some Non IC recessed lights.
  • GW
    GW Member Posts: 4,691
    Ok then you don't have a boiler problem, or at least ...you have at least one problem.

    The RC is exacerbating the losses, constant circulation and bad heat losses are a tough combination
    Gary Wilson
    Wilson Services, Inc
    Northampton, MA
    gary@wilsonph.com
    kcopp