Nest Thermostats

Wellness

@ChrisJ. Understood. I've been on the receiving end of those kind of consumer tirades and you wonder: what happened to civility?

ratio

I think it's part of "cheapest". At least, in my experience the ones who are willing to hire us instead of the lowest bidder are significantly more likely to act ...well... normal. (That could be because they generally have a prior relationship though.) But the ones who want everything as cheap as possible --or cheaper-- are the ones who complain & berate the most.

Sal Santamaura

Wellness said:

...We'd still be wrestling with those ones that had the Mercury bubble in them

Got one of them-there mercury-wetted Honeywell stats on the wall. If/when we move, it'll be replaced with a current product and come with us to the new house. As opposed to "wrestling," my sentiment is "appreciating."

GreenGene

It's my opinion that our products should have to go through us to get to the consumer, this keeps manufacturers on their toes. The consumer, even one that can wire a t-stat, is not educated enough to know whether a product will do what it claims, if we install something within the first few installs we know if there are issues and we drop that product, that's why they go around us.

The Nest was one of the few that had nothing to do with HVAC and went direct to consumers, it's a sales tactic, they knew once we figured out it's nothing amazing it wouldn't fly, it has wifi and smart phone capability, so does everybody else, they also violated copyright laws but that's another issue.

ChrisJ

I guess if you define putting a level on it and setting the anticipator as "wrestling".

They're easy to setup but I personally have no interest in having one.

Dave_132

I believe what has been expressed on this thread gives validity to the Dunning - Kruger effect. No body has bashed the Eco bee, the lyric or others. There is nothing wrong with criticism as long as it is based in fact and not anecdotal . There may not be a place in the homes of older generations for the nest, but there certainly is with gen x and gen y. Someone commented that remote control authority of a thermostat was somewhat anal. I disagree . For those of us who travel frequently it is a useful device. I suppose I could ride a horse to work , but I prefer to take my truck. Ten years ago the talk was that Viega pro press would be here today and gone tomorrow . Both Viega pro press and Nest will out live all of there pallbearers.

ChrisJ

Dave said:

I believe what has been expressed on this thread gives validity to the Dunning - Kruger effect. No body has bashed the Eco bee, the lyric or others. There is nothing wrong with criticism as long as it is based in fact and not anecdotal . There may not be a place in the homes of older generations for the nest, but there certainly is with gen x and gen y. Someone commented that remote control authority of a thermostat was somewhat anal. I disagree . For those of us who travel frequently it is a useful device. I suppose I could ride a horse to work , but I prefer to take my truck. Ten years ago the talk was that Viega pro press would be here today and gone tomorrow . Both Viega pro press and Nest will out live all of there pallbearers.

I bet it won't.
10 years from now no one will even know what the Nest was.

Why do you think no one bashed the Ecobee or Lyric?
They're very similar to the Nest and yet, many professionals recommend them.

Why?

I've never touched either, so I cannot comment on them. I just know my feelings on the Nest. After that, I kind of gave up on a "smart" thermostat for a while.

Perhaps some others that recommend the Ecobee can say why? I don't recall many, if anyone talking about the Lyric but Ecobee is mentioned constantly here.

Gordy

Dave said:

I believe what has been expressed on this thread gives validity to the Dunning - Kruger effect. No body has bashed the Eco bee, the lyric or others. There is nothing wrong with criticism as long as it is based in fact and not anecdotal . There may not be a place in the homes of older generations for the nest, but there certainly is with gen x and gen y. Someone commented that remote control authority of a thermostat was somewhat anal. I disagree . For those of us who travel frequently it is a useful device. I suppose I could ride a horse to work , but I prefer to take my truck. Ten years ago the talk was that Viega pro press would be here today and gone tomorrow . Both Viega pro press and Nest will out live all of there pallbearers.

Dave people have traveled for decades with out the ability to control their home environment from their cell phone while gone for extended periods. Not hard to turn the thermostats down, and shut off the water supply. Maybe have a friend, or a neighbor check on the place.

I would worry more about the domestic water supply than my ability to control temperature via cell phone.

Ask my friend who went to Arizona for 6 months, and never turned off the main water supply. Thinking he was covered because a neighbor checked his house weekly over the winter.

Amazing how much water an upstairs cracked cpvc supply pipe to a bath can dump in a week. He ended up,with basically a whole new house except the shell........

GreenGene

I think the big plus to any smart thermostat is the ability for a person who travels to check on the home, most will be going with a security system so while you travel you'd get an alert for burglary, fire, water, temp out of range and you can tap into cameras and see.

Gordy

GreenGene said:

I think the big plus to any smart thermostat is the ability for a person who travels to check on the home, most will be going with a security system so while you travel you'd get an alert for burglary, fire, water, temp out of range and you can tap into cameras and see.

If your going to do all that. You may as well get a service that dispatches the appropriate authority to the home.

GreenGene

This is where it's going to start getting dicey, Comcast and some alarm companies are offering smart t-stats...........they don't have people versed in HVACR.

GreenGene

here's a good one

I am sharing here the fact that the thermostat we had from Comcast as part of our security system went crazy and started blowing hot air into our home even though it showed it was cooling our home.

http://forums.xfinity.com/t5/Customer-Service/Very-Dangerous-Thermostat/td-p/1331273

GreenGene

here's another


The first day after his security was installed, the digital thermostats malfunctioned and the temperature in his home plummeted, causing discomfort for his entire family. “

http://blog.frontpointsecurity.com/another-comcast-customer-encounters-serious-problems/

Dave_132

And if we didn't have enough problems maintaining our customers equipment, we now have utility company's hawking remote controlled "saver switches on the A/C condensing units which will shut them off when the electrical grid reaches capacity. They offer there customers a bogus discount to subscribe . I have had many service calls related to the failure and erratic operation of these devices. Here is a noble idea for the utility company's , build more plants to match the need. Because they are a monopoly in certain areas they run the risk of fines if they cannot provide their customers with the service they deserve . So this is their solution .

SWEI

Dave said:

Here is a noble idea for the utility company's , build more plants to match the need.

Most utilities would love to do just that, given the way their incomes are earned/allowed (primarily as a return on capital investment.) The truth is that the numbers frequently just don't make sense. If a power plant only operates a few hours per month, the ROI quite frankly sucks.

Gordy

A power generation utilities would much rather operate with a power deficit than a surplus. In the end where else will one turn if they don't like the service? There are ways to handle surpluses. Normally done by selling surplus power to deficit burdened stations. Sometimes out of state.

Dave_132

Someone told me that an environmental impact statement to construct even a conventional power plant can now take close to ten years (needs citation). I hope they are wrong. We cannot run this country on a plenty pack of aaa batteries. I also agree with Green Gene on home monitoring for security and HVAC. What is next for Comcast and Att ? Micro breweries perhaps. They seem to have there hands in everything else.

Gordy

Close. It depends where they want the site. Mostly how well the site lends itself to the construction of said plant. Let alone any wildlife, and water way impacts. It's a good thing really in light of past engineering disasters.

The work around use to be how the plant will economically impact neighboring communities. Jobs, taxes, growth etc.

GreenGene

Actually they don't need new power plants anymore, all of the large users, corporations, banks, all got all of OUR energy grants/rebates and they all have solar, wind and/or fuel cells to power their buildings and that took a big load off the grid.

Add to that the fact that people are becoming more energy efficient, led lights, better appliances, etc etc the need for more plants is over blown, there are people in construction who will use the media to push them, but it's just so they can profit, not because we need them, power plants should be a back up and night use system.

GreenGene

An exception would be that our demographics are changing, people are moving out of the northeast into the south and Florida, so they need to ramp their green technology, some states tend to see it as some sort of threat, we have vast areas of desert that can be used for wind and solar power and it's blockaded.

Overall our population is dropping, babyboomers are retiring and passing, so we'll see but there will be some changes coming. One is that millennials for the most part don't want a home, they want a condo or apt. Home values are going to drop and home construction will drop considerably.

Take a look at Zillow, set your map for homes for sale and look at your surrounding towns, the amount of homes on the market for over a year is astounding, based on that most towns should not be processing any building permits, the market is saturated, if they don't stop building it's going to collapse.

Steamhead

GreenGene said:

This is where it's going to start getting dicey, Comcast and some alarm companies are offering smart t-stats...........they don't have people versed in HVACR.

GreenGene said:

here's a good one

I am sharing here the fact that the thermostat we had from Comcast as part of our security system went crazy and started blowing hot air into our home even though it showed it was cooling our home.

http://forums.xfinity.com/t5/Customer-Service/Very-Dangerous-Thermostat/td-p/1331273

GreenGene said:

here's another


The first day after his security was installed, the digital thermostats malfunctioned and the temperature in his home plummeted, causing discomfort for his entire family. “

http://blog.frontpointsecurity.com/another-comcast-customer-encounters-serious-problems/

Looks like Comcast is doing what it always does- falling flat on its face. Their cable/Internet service in the Baltimore area is pretty bad, with regular outages. I refuse to deal with them at all. Wonder what made them think they could succeed with thermostats?

SWEI

Much of the country is served by transmission lines which have suffered decades of deferred maintenance, are overburdened, or both. New utility-scale RE generation frequently requires major infrastructure upgrades, which generally come with their own environmental challenges. Distributed generation is a big part of the answer, but most utilities see that as eating into 'their' business. The answer is probably rate decoupling, but the big corporate utilities find that even scarier.
https://www.ase.org/resources/utility-rate-decoupling-0

ChrisJ

Steamhead said:

GreenGene said:

This is where it's going to start getting dicey, Comcast and some alarm companies are offering smart t-stats...........they don't have people versed in HVACR.

GreenGene said:

here's a good one

I am sharing here the fact that the thermostat we had from Comcast as part of our security system went crazy and started blowing hot air into our home even though it showed it was cooling our home.

http://forums.xfinity.com/t5/Customer-Service/Very-Dangerous-Thermostat/td-p/1331273

GreenGene said:

here's another


The first day after his security was installed, the digital thermostats malfunctioned and the temperature in his home plummeted, causing discomfort for his entire family. “

http://blog.frontpointsecurity.com/another-comcast-customer-encounters-serious-problems/

Looks like Comcast is doing what it always does- falling flat on its face. Their cable/Internet service in the Baltimore area is pretty bad, with regular outages. I refuse to deal with them at all. Wonder what made them think they could succeed with thermostats?

We have Comcast because we have no choice for decent internet here. Their service is ok for internet, considering we're surrounded by farms, but their customer service and everything about them blows.

I'd be willing to switch to a better company even at half the speed.

Dave_132

We also have Comcast sadly and there service is pathetic . We pay for high speed internet and in the middle of a program it shuts down and flashes a notification "insufficient bandwidth". There statement never reflects a discount for not delivering a service that we payed for. Xcel energy our gas and electric provider delivers the same poor customer service . As a mechanical contractor I have found that you could die of old age waiting for them to set a gas meter or close a loop on the electrical service after your inspection by the building dept. has been signed off and approved. I am starting to see a pattern here coast to coast. These large company's have outlived there usefulness .

ChrisJ

@Dave
Notice anything?

Some don't like the Nest. Some love it.

Everyone hates Comcast even those who get good service from them.

Dave_132

Well said, I cannot improve on that. At least Nest has some admirers. Myself being one . As they say, things can always be worse.

BobC

" These large company's have outlived there usefulness " I want to welcome you to the land of deregulation where the rish get richer and the average guy gets screwed.

We were sold a bill of goods when they separated the supply form the delivery side. this allowed them to do what ever they had to for maximum profit.

Back when the utilities were owned by the city we got a fair deal now it's Katy bar the door!

Bob

Chester

GreenGene said:

Actually they don't need new power plants anymore"

We might not need new 'baseload' plants but, ironically, the more renewables we have on the system the more fossil-fueled power plant capacity we need to install to back it up. That's because all of the wind and solar capacity that's coming on the market is intermittent (only generates power 20-30% of the time and can't be controlled by the Regional Transmission Operators). Grid operators need to ensure that have resources on the system that can start quickly when needed and that have the flexibility to ramp up and down to compensate. So, for every megawatt of wind we add to the system we need around 2 megawatts of new traditional power plants, like simple-cycle gas-fired combustion turbines, to back it up. So far, across the U.S. about 20 gigawatts of coal-fired capacity has retired and we've already started to see significant nuclear retirements. Renewables are great (although they're expensive) ... but we still need power plants to keep the lights on.

"power plants should be a back up and night use system."

It's actually more of the opposite. One of the challenges with integrating wind onto the system is that it produces a disproportionate amount of its power in the off-peak hours (i.e. at night). That actually creates a challenge because you have to turn off or ramp down power plants that would typically run overnight, and then you have to make sure you have what you need to meet daily peak loads.

FYI: building a new power plant these days typically has a 3- to 4-year development cycle, depending on lots of different variables. There are obviously some places you can't build a new power plant today no matter what.

Dave_132

In Colorado we are charged a two tier electrical rate for residential use in the summer. The idea being it will discourage use of Air conditioning . You are allowed the lower rate up to a certain amount of kWh and then the rate jumps substantially. They are doing the same thing with water use. The growth that the state has experienced in the last three years is unsustainable . Changes have to be made or we will have to close our borders.
That includes more power plants and more reservoirs.