My local heros

j a_2

. 10 years of recent service tags on boiler, Beautiful white and red trucks, lots of nice looking heating guy uniforms...This chimney was full op and beyond breach...

j a_2

Ya think...I hear there on a company cruise celebrating their profits...lol

KC_Jones

j a said:

Ya think...I hear there on a company cruise celebrating their profits...lol

Don't you mean the celebrating of the screwing of their customers?

ChrisJ

Are they licensed in MA?

Hmmmm?

jonny88

Looks beautiful.Seen it many times but the service tags on boiler does give you a sense of security.Any wonder why homeowners are afraid to call plumbers or whatever these guys call themselves.Unfortunately we are all lumped in the same boat.Very sad.BTW ChrisJ i have seen licensed crews do this.But as long as you throw inspector a bone once in a while and join all their little clubs life is good.

ChrisJ

jonny88 said:

Looks beautiful.Seen it many times but the service tags on boiler does give you a sense of security.Any wonder why homeowners are afraid to call plumbers or whatever these guys call themselves.Unfortunately we are all lumped in the same boat.Very sad.BTW ChrisJ i have seen licensed crews do this.But as long as you throw inspector a bone once in a while and join all their little clubs life is good.

Exactly.

How does that make us homeowners feel good about hiring anyone?

jonny88

Exactly Chris.I wish I knew the answer but changes have to be made from the top down starting with tighter codes and enforcing the codes.Stiff penalties for these thiefs when caught.It is a very difficult question but it sucks loosing out on jobs to these people as they always undercut you.

j a_2

We can talk and beat it to death...My said opinion, nothing will change.....Money rules....Hopefully our inputs will bring it to the attention of some homeowners, before it becomes an issue

4Johnpipe

I was the third contractor called to work on this boiler...kept going out...

Filled 2 kitchen size bags with debris...

ChrisJ

And here's mine after I specifically asked an HVAC guy to check the draft because I was concerned. Notice pieces of terracotta in a stainless lined chimney?

Not only was it plugged but it was also grossly undersized for the boiler and it was not cleanable because someone jammed several sections of 6" round liner in a 4x7 opening.

Steamhead

You can't fix stupid!

PMJ

ChrisJ said:

jonny88 said:

Looks beautiful.Seen it many times but the service tags on boiler does give you a sense of security.Any wonder why homeowners are afraid to call plumbers or whatever these guys call themselves.Unfortunately we are all lumped in the same boat.Very sad.BTW ChrisJ i have seen licensed crews do this.But as long as you throw inspector a bone once in a while and join all their little clubs life is good.

Exactly.

How does that make us homeowners feel good about hiring anyone?

Just curious if anyone thinks Angie's List has had any impact on things - better/worse/no impact?

j a_2

Chris I do not have a good answer for you...sorry....

JStar

If it's not easily seen by a homeowner, a bad technician is more likely to ignore an issue. Chimney/liner work seems to get the worst of it.

JStar

Hatterasguy said:

JStar said:

If it's not easily seen by a homeowner, .

.............you mean...........like...........stuff down in the basement???

Yes, unforunately, if a homeowner doesn't know about the inner workings of their own house, they can be more easily mislead or taken advatange of. I wish there were some kind of HEATING HELP resource for those homeowners....

Docfletcher

I'm one homeowner wary of bringing anyone in for anything. Especially the boiler. So I do it myself as best I can. None of you guys are near me, if you were though I think I would be OK with bringing in one of you. I'd like a pro to drop the blower and do an inspection and cleaning. That way I'd know for sure where I stand with this boiler life left wise.

RobG

The worst thing is when the people are elderly and do not have easy access to the equipment and rely on the integrity of the hacks. At least a healthy adult can go online and do some research, older folks have to place their trust in others to do the right thing. Too many people take advantage of that fact. I wish I could get a tax credit on the pro-bono work that I have done to keep heat and hot water going for some. Screw the tax credit! I enjoy the Christmas cards!

PMJ

I write down the specs for what I want for anything at the house - common sense stuff really - but I write it down before asking someone to look at anything. I will make a computer drawing too quite often. I find that the hacks don't even quote then when they see this and find out I know something about the subjects - they know there are easier fish to fry out there. I know when I have found an expert as the experts seem to even welcome working with a buyer that knows something. Unfortunately, I must report that there are way too few experts out there and it sure is a pain working through the hacks to get to one.

Noel Kelly_3

Two things that I never miss from my days servicing oil...late night/early morning calls and plugged chimneys. Oh...and plugged boilers too! Kudos to those that continue to battle mediocrity!!

Harvey Ramer

If everyone were top notch, that would mean less work for us or a lower price.

Things are what they are. That is the way of humanity. When we run across this stuff, which is almost daily, we shake our heads, fix it and move on.

No good comes out of degrading the competition. We stand on our own virtues.

Harvey Ramer

I don't turn a blind eye. I fix the problem and show and explain to the customer what I did. They appreciate that. When I leave, I try to make sure they are happy. If I started the whole, he should have done this and that was stupid, the customer would be displeased and out of humor when I left.

If it is a safety situation, they will be duly informed with future prevention recommendations

My methods work. I have more work than I can handle.

jonny88

I agree Hatt if they are held accountable who knows they might even change their attitudes.I hate cleaning up someone else's mess as it is always difficult facing the customer and seeing their response when they have been the victims of these contractors.I see many of these boiler a day companies and they are busy to.Maybe this nonsense goes on a bit more often here (NY).

Steamhead

We have found that the hacks badmouth us constantly. The only response is to fight back- usually, producing the manufacturers' instructions is all we need to make our point.

We've all heard "don't badmouth the competition" but nobody follows that anymore. Fortunately, the facts don't lie.

4Johnpipe

Just speak the truth and remember to say what you mean, mean what you say and you don't have to say it mean...

j a_2

I believe, the best you can do is inform the customer of your findings, if they hired you then you can put it it writing, but if there just using you as a defense at the hacky wacky, it getting written....I think but I might be wrong the larger companies tend to be,maybe not hacks but have no issues sending out untrained employees, and charging top shelf..that's just plain wrong....Aslo sad is the small guys have zero time to get to deeply involved in crap that does not apply to them...If the small guys hands are not moving he is not making money to support his family...Simply, little guys have no time for B S...Its something you learn and get hardened to..

jonny88

Great post @j a .

j a_2

Thanks johnny 88. You know, the deal all to well I am sure...zero time for BS..Zero time to write up hacks work for owner to chase him...That's just how it is....Hay tell your guys to take it easy on Brady down there in court....think not

jonny88

inflategate ,deflategate,I wish that was my biggest concern right now.You know how it goes everyone likes to see the great come tumbling down whether its true or not.Take care

j a_2

Totally understand, just adding a little humor...What those guys do has no affect on the rest of us..there in a leage of there own....Good luck with the daily battle....Me I have grandsons babtism this weekend..Nothing else matters this weekend...

ChrisJ

Harvey Ramer said:

If everyone were top notch, that would mean less work for us or a lower price.



Things are what they are. That is the way of humanity. When we run across this stuff, which is almost daily, we shake our heads, fix it and move on.



No good comes out of degrading the competition. We stand on our own virtues.

That's fine, except when it kills, or almost kills people who are paying the guy to service their system.

That is never acceptable, ever.

If someone isn't capable of handling that responsibility they shouldn't be working on gas/oil burners or anything connected to a flue.

j a_2

Agree and agree...But like I said you can pass along all the info you want to the owner if you find fault,and you should...But that's it, and I never ever put it in writing unless that person hired me...There are all to many out here that will drop a dime for many reasons... Again little guys have zero time for B S...When I did dig deeper on a few occasions back in the day, I found the home owners trying to B S me as well....Just do the job you have agreed to do and follow the rules/laws set forth.... To many crazies out here and with internet you can't be to careful...People are funny...

Steamhead

ChrisJ said:

That's fine, except when it kills, or almost kills people who are paying the guy to service their system.

That is never acceptable, ever.

If someone isn't capable of handling that responsibility they shouldn't be working on gas/oil burners or anything connected to a flue.

A blocked chimney would certainly fit in this category. And we run into chimneys that are blocked or partly blocked all the time. I'm amazed we don't see more CO poisonings.

JStar

I write down everything wrong that I find. If I don't, who do you think will be blamed? The last person to see it, even if you didn't do the work. You have a responsibility as a technician to document any safety hazards and to disable an appliance, if necessary.

j a_2

Depends what ur called for...we see open wire boxs we see invented plumbing we see Asbestos we see fire hazards we see it all

JStar

If you see it, it becomes your responsibility to report it, or you can be held liable for misleading the homeowner.

j a_2

I think I missed your point...Is it your policy to go into ones home,say for tstat and start writing defects within there home....I hope not

Steamhead

JStar said:

You have a responsibility as a technician to ........... disable an appliance, if necessary.

That depends on where you are. In Maryland we don't have the authority to disable, according to one of our local inspectors. All we can do is document it. But I understand the laws are different elsewhere.

4Johnpipe

I have turned off appliances that were an imminent threat to life / safety. I notified the gas company and explained to landlords the seriousness and my liability in the situation. It has prompted service in 99.9% of the times I have done this. Remember in the eyes of the law the licensed professional is responsible once we are called to diagnose a system if a life / safety issue is present. That .1% ended up calling me back after a second opinion.

JStar

j a said:

I think I missed your point...Is it your policy to go into ones home,say for tstat and start writing defects within there home....I hope not

Why? If I'm in a home and witness a safety or health hazard, I have the responsibility as a professional technician to alert the homeowner of the situation and document it with a customer's signature, assuring that they understand the issue and do not hold me liable for any of it. I don't care if I'm only working on the boiler but I see the gutters are hanging off the side of the house. If I see it, I am obliged to document it. If I'm the last contractor in a house, I can get blamed for any problem in the home. In NJ, we do have the authority to red-tag and disable unsafe equipment.

ChrisJ

JStar said:

j a said:

I think I missed your point...Is it your policy to go into ones home,say for tstat and start writing defects within there home....I hope not

Why? If I'm in a home and witness a safety or health hazard, I have the responsibility as a professional technician to alert the homeowner of the situation and document it with a customer's signature, assuring that they understand the issue and do not hold me liable for any of it. I don't care if I'm only working on the boiler but I see the gutters are hanging off the side of the house. If I see it, I am obliged to document it. If I'm the last contractor in a house, I can get blamed for any problem in the home. In NJ, we do have the authority to red-tag and disable unsafe equipment.

How many hundreds of pages did you leave my house with?

RobG

I wouldn't care about the gutters as a safety issue, but if the gutters WERE hanging off the house what I would worry about was their check clearing!