Just noticed

Snowmelt

The original plumber didn't use a appliance adaptor and the termination piece isn't corect

Abracadabra

right next to a door and window

Jamie Hall

Abracadabra said:

right next to a door and window

Maybe he did it that way so the occupants would be able to keep an eye on it?

Snowmelt

The hole condo is like that

nicholas bonham-carter

Looks like the exhaust could be sucked into the intake, and we know what that means--more work for the local installers!--NBC

Paul Pollets

Another Giboni job...reversion of the boiler exhaust will make short order of the appliance.

icesailor

Jamie Hall said:

Abracadabra said:

right next to a door and window

Maybe he did it that way so the occupants would be able to keep an eye on it?

Maybe so the occupants could keep a nose out for the smell of Carbon Monoxide?

icesailor

Snowmelt said:

The hole condo is like that

That may be, but does the whole Condo meet NFPA 54 requirements for venting around windows and doors?

Who had their hand out behind and who was passing out Presidents and early heros?

Do they have hard wired CO detectors in each floor of each unit?

ChrisJ

I thought with direct vent appliances code required something like a minimum of 1 foot from windows that open?

Can't comment on the rest of the mess, just the window comment confused me.

bmwpowere36m3

I thought it was 1ft as well, minimum... so it should fine for clearance. As far as appearance, function, best practice that's another story.

RobG

That looks like the old style Takagi TK-2 vent terminations? I think they pulled that one out of their @%# because Rinnai had a direct vent and they didn't.

Snowmelt

Yep that what it looks like, the direct vent for early takagi units. I have a question for you rob. And I will get right to the question. Can I use a boiler ( utica cub) for that it's the same category 3 venting but it's 3 inch, while the tk is 4 inch. Just put a rudder at the termination.

RobG

I guess that you are trying to use the existing vent termination? It looks like a crappy design to me but the only people who can tell you if it can be used is ECR. Get it in writing, that thing looks like a recipe for flue gas reversion.

Snowmelt

Yes I'm trying to use the vent termination, it would be too much if I had to maneuver anything else, what options do I have with that existing?

icesailor

Inspectors that I know insisted on 4' from a door, and 4' from a window that could be opened. Take a 4' string, put one end on any part of the vent terminal, and swing a 4' arc. If any door or opening window fell into the arc, it wouldn't pass.

http://www.iapmo.org/California Plumbing Code/Chapter 05.pdf

Page 87.

ChrisJ

icesailor said:

Inspectors that I know insisted on 4' from a door, and 4' from a window that could be opened. Take a 4' string, put one end on any part of the vent terminal, and swing a 4' arc. If any door or opening window fell into the arc, it wouldn't pass.

http://www.iapmo.org/California Plumbing Code/Chapter 05.pdf

Page 87.

Certainly glad that's not the case where I live.
There only place I could vent anything would be my roof and on a 2 story house that's a nitemare.

In my opinion, once again, this is a case where they go way too far just like not allowing drip legs because some knucklehead might try to use it to connect something. Because we all know, he can't just as easy disconnect the union and add a tee or something there.

And yet, they still allow flexible aluminum duct to be used to vent clothes dryers. I'm still curious why clothes dryers are not required by law to have something similar to a spill switch that trips if it gets too hot.

Abracadabra

ChrisJ said:

..
And yet, they still allow flexible aluminum duct to be used to vent clothes dryers. I'm still curious why clothes dryers are not required by law to have something similar to a spill switch that trips if it gets too hot.

I think it's a matter of BTUs the appliance uses. A gas dryer is maybe 25000?

icesailor

People have died for less.

You have no idea of how easy it is for CO to get into a house and make people sick. And die.

There's nothing like a tasteless, odorless, and colorless/invisible gas to make your day.

I flew to a job one day commercially in a Cessna 402C aircraft. I was sitting in the Right Seat, with my UEI CO70A on. It was 40 degree OAT out and the cabin heater was running. Its just basically a master kerosene heater run on Av-Gas. It has a fan to blow air across the HX. When in flight at 160 KN, the outside air becomes the fan. The stale air blows out the back of the aircraft. The PIC slowly taxi'd out to the end of the runway to wait for clearance. My CO detector was going off at 65 PPM. It dropped to zero once we were airborne.

Many people who go out fishing on charter boats with big overhanging upper bridge decks get seasick. Especially in following seas. So they go below and get REALLY sick. From the exhaust and CO that gets sucked back by the draft and following winds.

I once read in an article about CO in a trade magazine.

If a room held 10,000 ping pong balls, and each ping pong ball represented a Part Per Million, and four of those ping pongs represented a PPM of CO, it would kill you. That got my attention so much that I paid attention. Or, why I carry my CO detector when I travel. I once found CO levels in a hotel in Rocky Mount, NC.

ChrisJ

Abracadabra said:

ChrisJ said:

..
And yet, they still allow flexible aluminum duct to be used to vent clothes dryers. I'm still curious why clothes dryers are not required by law to have something similar to a spill switch that trips if it gets too hot.

I think it's a matter of BTUs the appliance uses. A gas dryer is maybe 25000?

Not sure, I want to say that sounds about right.
However, how many dryer fires do we see constantly due to clogged vents?

This isn't a matter of not venting, it's a matter of people burning.

ChrisJ

icesailor said:

People have died for less.

You have no idea of how easy it is for CO to get into a house and make people sick. And die.

There's nothing like a tasteless, odorless, and colorless/invisible gas to make your day.

I flew to a job one day commercially in a Cessna 402C aircraft. I was sitting in the Right Seat, with my UEI CO70A on. It was 40 degree OAT out and the cabin heater was running. Its just basically a master kerosene heater run on Av-Gas. It has a fan to blow air across the HX. When in flight at 160 KN, the outside air becomes the fan. The stale air blows out the back of the aircraft. The PIC slowly taxi'd out to the end of the runway to wait for clearance. My CO detector was going off at 65 PPM. It dropped to zero once we were airborne.

Many people who go out fishing on charter boats with big overhanging upper bridge decks get seasick. Especially in following seas. So they go below and get REALLY sick. From the exhaust and CO that gets sucked back by the draft and following winds.

I once read in an article about CO in a trade magazine.

If a room held 10,000 ping pong balls, and each ping pong ball represented a Part Per Million, and four of those ping pongs represented a PPM of CO, it would kill you. That got my attention so much that I paid attention. Or, why I carry my CO detector when I travel. I once found CO levels in a hotel in Rocky Mount, NC.

Perhaps,
But I guess the theory with direct venting is because you're not pulling air for the burner from the structure then it's not as easy for it to enter via a window or a door.

My question to you is if many if not most places and manufacturers claim 1 foot is enough, and some others claim 4 feet, who is right?

Personally I have no data or knowledge to say which is right but I would hope whoever came up with 1 foot did have such information.

Who is to say 4 feet is enough? Let's make it 30 just to be safe.

Speaking of CO detectors, I'd like to install a good hardwired one. I have an A\C plug in one but I'd like a really good one.

Any recommendations?

bmwpowere36m3

icesailor said:

Inspectors that I know insisted on 4' from a door, and 4' from a window that could be opened. Take a 4' string, put one end on any part of the vent terminal, and swing a 4' arc. If any door or opening window fell into the arc, it wouldn't pass.

http://www.iapmo.org/California Plumbing Code/Chapter 05.pdf

Page 87.

Right from that document (pg. 83): Mechanical draft 4' and direct-vent 1'.

RobG

I think the thread got a little off topic. He wants to know whether he can reuse the existing vent termination with an ECR boiler. I believe only the manufacturer can answer that.