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One pipe steam header shortcut sending wet steam, causing massive water hammer at ends

wcs5050
wcs5050 Member Posts: 131
Please see image. In regards to Hartford loop connection, what was I thinking?! (Tee runs straight to system, branch swings to pick up equalizer.) Normally one would 90 off the riser, run through a tee to the equalizer 90, and feed the system from the tee's vertical branch. I've never made a system connection like this on my other steam installs, and regrettably did it here for boiler placement, and fitting ease.
I'm in full belief that I'm sending saturated steam to the system, also indicated by site glass pushing way down.
It is a small system without end returns. Pressuretrol is set at the bottom end, and no pressure develops anyway. All new Vent-Rite rad air vents. Two new main end vents. Preparing myself to repipe supply header. Any thoughts would be helpful.
On a side note, has anyone seen a Model 400 LWCO fail to interrupt burner?
Job done in Novemeber, and was "fine" until the deep cold hit.
Thank you for your comments.

Comments

  • nicholas bonham-carter
    nicholas bonham-carter Member Posts: 8,576
    When you redo the header to conform to requirements in the manual, you will have dry steam.
    Put on a low pressure gauge (0-3 psi) to verify that the pressuretrol is working to keep the pressure under 1.5 psi.--NBC
  • icesailor
    icesailor Member Posts: 7,265
    I found in my life that many "shortcuts" I tried, ended up with my taking the long way around.

    Its like sailboat racing in light air. The fleet is all bunched together. Everyone has "bad air". You decide to go right. The rest of the fleet stays left. If the wind fills in from the right, you're genius and you beat the fleet to the mark. If the wind doesn't fill in, you might make out because the fleet stays in the bad air but they still get there. But if the wind fills in from the left, you're toast and last. Same with wind shifts.
  • wcs5050
    wcs5050 Member Posts: 131
    So my steam is all wet. There goes the shortcut savings. Lesson learned. Thanks fellas.
    W
    Hey icesailor, you must copy/paste that prophetic 2nd paragraph, or maybe it was just for me. Thanks again. Glad I finally joined up.
  • Double D
    Double D Member Posts: 442
    It appears that this is a counter flow system. Can you post photos a little higher up? Which way do the mains pitch?
  • icesailor
    icesailor Member Posts: 7,265
    edited January 2015
    "" Hey icesailor, you must copy/paste that prophetic 2nd paragraph, or maybe it was just for me. Thanks again. Glad I finally joined up. ""

    That comes from my many years of experience chasing wind. Both on soft and hard water.

    Life is full of little lessons. Its how we can apply them in our daily lives that make the difference.

    The comment and anything I say is for anyone that finds some enjoyment in it.

    My wife asked me the other day, who said this. I couldn't remember so I looked it up and book marked it.

    ""Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.”
    ― Søren Kierkegaard ""

    Or, another way, we all have to experience everything we do, good or bad, to get to where we are today and want to get to.
  • wcs5050
    wcs5050 Member Posts: 131
    DD
    Mains pitch back to boiler. Condensate drains back while steam passes over it. Problem is I'm sending too much moisture up the main and overloading normal amount of condensate. Returns are vertical downward tees just after main riser, one on each side.
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    wcs5050 said:

    Please see image. In regards to Hartford loop connection, what was I thinking?! (Tee runs straight to system, branch swings to pick up equalizer.) Normally one would 90 off the riser, run through a tee to the equalizer 90, and feed the system from the tee's vertical branch. I've never made a system connection like this on my other steam installs, and regrettably did it here for boiler placement, and fitting ease.
    I'm in full belief that I'm sending saturated steam to the system, also indicated by site glass pushing way down.
    It is a small system without end returns. Pressuretrol is set at the bottom end, and no pressure develops anyway. All new Vent-Rite rad air vents. Two new main end vents. Preparing myself to repipe supply header. Any thoughts would be helpful.
    On a side note, has anyone seen a Model 400 LWCO fail to interrupt burner?
    Job done in Novemeber, and was "fine" until the deep cold hit.
    Thank you for your comments.

    The Equalizer should come off the end of the Header, after the mains. If I am looking at your photo correctly, I don't even see a Header. Please look at the installation manual and follow those instructions, at a minimum.
    wcs5050
  • wcs5050
    wcs5050 Member Posts: 131
    Thanks Fred. I was thinking for myself that day, and thought I found a "better" way. I am normally mr. follow the instructions, but not that day.
  • Double D
    Double D Member Posts: 442
    I thought that's what you had but I only saw the return line from the left main, not where it attached. The system you're working on is pretty much like the bottom left drawing?
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 15,329
    Unfortunatley for all of us who ever picked up a wrench the old saying applies "if you don't have the time to do it right, how will you find the time to do it over"
  • wcs5050
    wcs5050 Member Posts: 131
    Problem solved. Thanks all for the comments. I'm absolutely amazed by the difference in performance, never mind Paul Bunyan with his sledgehammer. System is now as silent as the grave (almost). 3 90s, 2 unions, 3 hrs, var nipples. Replaced a handful of the recent vents too, as the water hammer abused them to failure.
  • wcs5050
    wcs5050 Member Posts: 131
    Follow the instructions. they already did all the thinking.
  • Fred
    Fred Member Posts: 8,542
    Actually each of those Mains should tie individually into the header. Also, I see a 3/4" or 1" copper pipe that goes up behind that Black iron elbow. Where does that go? Did you install a Hartford loop in the equalizer and do all of your returns tie together below the water line?
  • Mark N
    Mark N Member Posts: 1,115
    According to first post this is a counter flow system. The way it is piped all the condensate flowing back toward boiler is going back down the risers into the boiler. Find a proper piping diagram for counter flow. A Hartford loop isn't needed for a counter flow system, but can be used.
  • Gordo
    Gordo Member Posts: 852
    edited January 2015
    @wcs5050: Kudos to you for stepping up and doing the right thing.
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    "Reducing our country's energy consumption, one system at a time"
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Baltimore, MD (USA) and consulting anywhere.
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/all-steamed-up-inc