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Reducing Coupling on Two Upstairs Radiators at end of run causing Problems?

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Comments

  • Don_197
    Don_197 Member Posts: 184
    Put 1" piping between the tops and bottoms of the two radiators and leave em where they are.............enter in the bottom left of the left radiator with the piping out of the floor, exit out of the bottom right of the one on the right into the floor, and call it a towel or sweater warmer.....DONE!! :D
    icesailor
  • icesailor
    icesailor Member Posts: 7,265
    You don't need any nipples. Don said it in a shorter way. I'd just connect them together properly.

    You bought the house the way it is. If it was piped correctly, would you have not bought the house? If you piped the two radiators in place properly, and it works, are you going to sell the house because of it?

    I tried to explain and discourage you from trying to take the radiators apart. Even "I" wouldn't do that without a far better reason.
  • ww
    ww Member Posts: 263
    ok...i'll see what happens don, i contacted plumbing dealer and was told they had some left/right nipples to eliminate the need for a union...the main thing is there are options. thanks
  • ww
    ww Member Posts: 263
    what i mean by nipples is this...

    if i connect the two radiators together i can use a union between two nipples and that would be it.

    to eliminate the union i could get a nipple that has a right and left thread..this way when i turn the pipe clockwise the radiators will be pulled together by the pipe eliminating the need for a union. the top would have a one inch pipe and the bottom would be 1 1/4 inches.

    i'm glad you meant to discourage the deal with joining the radiators and taking them apart. that would entail alot and i wouldn't gain alot. thanks
  • SWEI
    SWEI Member Posts: 7,356
    You would need a LH threaded bushing on one radiator and a RH threaded on the other to make that work.
  • Don_197
    Don_197 Member Posts: 184
    You could sweat copper together easily enough............plenty of give to get couplings in there in that amount of space.........even if you had a left handed bushing and right handed bushing.....pulling them together would necessitate making the supply and return piping longer as well.......you may be overthinking this a bit.
    icesailor
  • RobG
    RobG Member Posts: 1,850
    If you did it with copper adapters you can connect the top and bottom of the rads. I can't imagine using two alternate thread nipples. And with copper you will get them just as close as a nipple that you would have to get a pipe wench in between anyway. Carl found a fitting that would allow you to get them pretty close together.

    http://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/151732/help-finding-a-fitting#latest

    Rob
  • Paul48
    Paul48 Member Posts: 4,470
    Every radiator valve and el has a union connection. What's the big deal?
    Canuckericesailor
  • ww
    ww Member Posts: 263
    I just figured I'd make it look like one big radiator..but in the scheme of things not a big deal..attached is photo of the radiator showing how it would look close together and the other one with a union.
  • ww
    ww Member Posts: 263
    these copper fittings are 3/4 of an inch and not an inch. thanks for sending it along. will remember for another application.

    this whole thread started because the radiator was brought down from 1 inch piping to 1/2 inch copper pipe and cutting the gpm of circulation to four times less...

    since 1/2 inch pipe will let 4 times less gpm of flow when compared to a one inch pipe gpm flow..that means you need four 1/2 inch pipes to get the gpm flow of a 1 inch pipe.
    the Icesailor explained all this .

    I will not go down to 3/4 of an inch for any reason when I can put 1 inch piping within the loop. I've looked at all the piping sizes, the gpm flow rates, how that differs with various pipe sizes,etc.

  • SWEI
    SWEI Member Posts: 7,356
    edited October 2014
    The Brasscraft adapter I found comes in 1/2", 3/4" and 1" sizes. If you decide to go that route, you'll need to seal the NPT threads using something that will tolerate the heat of soldering. High temp RTV might work, but I'll bet someone here knows of a better option.
  • icesailor
    icesailor Member Posts: 7,265
    This is being way overthought.

    First of all, you are limited by the spacing between the risers. The new radiator is going to be a lot longer than the space given. That's what the first installers were dealing with. You don't need 1 1/4" and 1" to connect the radiators together. That would only be required if the radiators were the maximum length for the application. If the system was still gravity and the supply/return was 1", you'd need at least 1" between the two radiators. Because it is now pumped, 3/4" should be OK. Personally, I think 1" would be a fine thing. Practically, 3/4" should be OK.

    Go around the house and try to find a radiator that is the same spacing between the 1" risers through the floor. If you find one, you can figure out how much radiation went into that room.

    There's all kinds of ways to do what you want to do. R&L bushing, couplings and nipples shouldn't be part of your plan.
  • ww
    ww Member Posts: 263
    edited October 2014
    ok..all that is off the table now with the taking apart the radiator.. priced out the copper line,fittings..etc...and won't sweat it in because the fittings are alot and would have to buy alot extra..i'm going to go with the biggest sizes of unions,nipples i have.

    the supply and return lines are one inch and the radiators when connected are longer than the pipes coming from the floor so i'll just use some elbows and connect them all and bring the radiator out a bit from the wall.

    luckily with this site i've been able to take different things and use them to my advantage. the main thing is that i have an understanding of how all this works and am able to see what works. tips i've been given here will be used in other applications as well.

    i noticed the water was dark on the bottom of the radiators..i may have to flush them out a bit before i install them. i'll also flush it out when i fill up the system again..and put a hose on the boiler to floor drain and leave the water on for awhile.
  • ww
    ww Member Posts: 263
    edited October 2014
    Don, As per what you mentioned previously... I have some 1 1/4 unions and nipples in the box. When I get back to attaching the two radiators you mention just use one inch pipe on the bottom as well which is 1 1/4. I have some other stuff like 1 1/4 inch bushings to 1 inch as well as a bunch of nipples,unions,etc for 1 inch pipe.

    Since I have all this stuff should I put 1 1/4 pipe on the bottom or just use the bushing to make it 1 inch? I have all these options since I have all the nipples,etc. Just curious if having the bigger flow pipe on the bottom would between the attached radiators would help.

    the outer sides of the radiators are 1 1/4 inch as well. The floor pipes are 1 inch.

    I
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 14,457
    Looks like that was originally a gravity system. That explains the pipe sizes- there was no pump when it was first put in. So they had to keep the resistance to the flowing water as low as they could.

    It also explains why that 1/2" piping didn't work. Assuming all the pipes in the system were originally sized the same way, the smaller piping on that radiator would simply cause the water to go elsewhere where there was less resistance.

    You have to get into the heads of the Dead Men when working on these systems. The guy who installed that radiator didn't.
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
    icesailor
  • ww
    ww Member Posts: 263
    Can anyone clarify this?

    Are the valves for steam and hot water interchangeable?..I know the hot water valves have a small hole in them.

    Where ever I go I am handed a steam valve and told I can use that..I was told I need a special valve for hot water only.
  • ww
    ww Member Posts: 263
    I've determined that the valves are not interchangeable...as some plumbing supplies think they are to move the merchandise.

    Buyer beware...Do your homework...don't let your fate be put in the hands of someone trying to sell you a bill of goods.

    I hooked up the radiator with the one inch pipe and new valve..I used one radiator for now since I don't need all that heat in the room..and it works great..heats up really hot and is fine.
  • icesailor
    icesailor Member Posts: 7,265
    I think that some of us here were suggesting that you do what you did.

    Some of us might be suggesting that you look for a longer/wider radiator. Look around for one that has a greater centerline measurement from the floor to the centerline of the inlet/outlet of the radiator.

    Measure the other radiators in the house. You might find one with an exact fit between the centerlines of the supply risers. Look for a radiator like that. Then, you can use shorter and smaller blocks on the radiator.
    ww
  • ww
    ww Member Posts: 263
    the reason i did that was because i thought that may be the case and also the dead mean were speaking to me too!..ok..great..thanks..will keep an eye out for something that may fit..but in the mean time it gets hot and fast too. ..the circulator plus the gpm extra achieved by using the 1 inch pipe over the 1/2 inch piping...
  • jeepwm69
    jeepwm69 Member Posts: 18
    @ww, I'm having similar issues with my upstairs radiators. So you just used larger lines to get flow?

    https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/169089/upstairs-radiators-not-getting-hot#latest
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