steam boiler system problem

thetabes

I need help, here is the story. In 2000 I had a new peerless boiler put into my 1929 cape cod style house in Michigan. Things worked well for about 9 years, then I noticed occassionaly certain radiators were not getting hot. Thinking the vents had gone bad I replaced the vents on 4 radiators. (single valve radiators) The problem continued. The company that installed it came out several times to try and solve the problem: adjusted the flame, no change, They said there must be a leak in the system. I have looked for 4 years now trying to find a leak, no obvious success.



The boiler's pressure gauge show's negative pressure and the system works but inadequately, there doesn't seem to be enough pressure to get all the radiators fully hot like it used to do. The boiler will never shut off on its own when it reaches the 1.5 PSI, but I have been controlling it by the thermostat the last few years.



I have meticously looked and listened for leaks in the pipes and radiators for years and noticed no leaks or wet spots, Could it be a leak in the boiler? and how would I check?

I have well water, it is added to the boiler automatically, there is a hartford loop. I just need some input from some experts before I pay money again for someone that doesn't know how to solve the problem. thanks in advance.



(I'm paranoid to go a vacation in the winter, worried that the radiator by the thermastat will be the one that doesn't get hot and my heating bill will be larger than my house payment)

Paul48

Auto-Feed

First, you need to know if you are constantly adding water to the system. Make sure the Low Water Cutoff is working. Shut  the auto-feed off and monitor the water line to see if you are losing water.

Jamie Hall

So many possibilities...

Reading the pressure gauge -- if it the usual 0 to 30 psig gauge -- doesn't tell one much.  The thing is there to keep the code and insurance folks happy, and is useless for diagnosing steam problems.



As Paul notes, step one is to find out if you have a leak.  And, as he says, the best way to do that is to first, make sure the low water cutoff is working.  Then, turn off the autofeeder.  In fact, close the valves to it.  Then observe the water level.  It will drop -- most one pipe steam systems lose a little water through the vents -- but it shouldn't drop more than an inch a day, if that.  Many systems it will be much less than that.  It is important to read the water level when the system is relatively cool -- wait at least half an hour if not more after the system has run.  And I would use a clothes pin on the gauge tube as a reference.



It is remarkably difficult to find a steam leak, as the steam evaporates.  Get back to us on what the water level check shows, though, and if it seems there is a leak maybe we can come up with some ideas as to how to find it.



In the meantime -- are the misbehaving radiators all on one steam main?  Can you trace that main in the basement and see how far along it, if at all, it gets hot?  It may be that there is a low place which is trapping water; that would do it.



I might note that if the system worked right at one time, then something has changed (a rather obvious remark) and the trick is to find out what.

kcopp

pictures...

help a lot... Are the main vents working? Are the pipes insulated....?

Paul48

Single Valve Radiators???

Just so we're clear....This is a 1 pipe system, with 1 pipe to each radiator?

ARCFUEL

a little help

To check the boiler for leaks. Shut the main switch. Remove top and side cleanouts on Peerless boiler. Flood the boiler. With a flashlight look in between the sections as well as the chamber area. Also Peerless is notorious for leaking gaskets. Check the front round plate and the coil plate. Even if you do not have a coil check the blank plate.

Sometimes returns are the culprit. If you can shut the boiler for one night. Shut the main switch and automatic feed valve (if you have one). Mark the water level in the gauge glass. If you lose any water then either boiler or returns are leaking.

The boiler is 9 years old - chances of oxidation are high.

On a personal rec.install either a water meter on the feed line of the boiler (after the coil, if one present) or install an Hydrolevel VXT series feeder. The results from doing this is PRICELESS. Hope this helps.

ARCFUEL

a little help

To check the boiler for leaks. Shut the main switch. Remove top and side cleanouts on Peerless boiler. Flood the boiler. With a flashlight look in between the sections as well as the chamber area. Also Peerless is notorious for leaking gaskets. Check the front round plate and the coil plate. Even if you do not have a coil check the blank plate.

Sometimes returns are the culprit. If you can shut the boiler for one night. Shut the main switch and automatic feed valve (if you have one). Mark the water level in the gauge glass. If you lose any water then either boiler or returns are leaking.

The boiler is 9 years old - chances of oxidation are high.

On a personal rec.install either a water meter on the feed line of the boiler (after the coil, if one present) or install an Hydrolevel VXT series feeder. The results from doing this is PRICELESS. Hope this helps.

thetabes

more info on my steam boiler system

gentleman, thank you for your input. My auto shut off does work, so I will close the auto water feed and see if indeed I;m losing water. I have clothes pins and that is a great suggestion. As soon as I know anything I will post

In the meantime , I will take some pictures. and try and post them. My radiators have one feed line and a airvent at the opposite end . The main line in the basement is visible and insulated with asbestos. The main has 2 airvents. One in the middle and one at the return line at the end. The end one works, I haven't checked the middle one lately.

nicholas bonham-carter

Negative pressure

That is probably a sign that the main vents are not up to snuff. Can you hear hissing, or whistling from the radiator vents?

Post some pictures of your main vents, and we will go from there.

Check your pressure to be lower than 1.5 psi.--NBC

BobC

Pressure too high?

i suspect your pressure gauge is no longer working and would think about adding a low pressure (0-3PSI) gauge onto the pigtail that feeds the pressuretrol.



You said the boiler never shuts off on pressure, how long does the boiler run to satisfy a call for heat? Your pigtail might be clogged and thus not working anymore. If the pigtail is clogged you could be building pressure to the extent that your air vents cannot reopen after getting hot once and are not letting steam into some of the radiators.  You might want to remove the pressuretrol and make sure the pigtail is clear - that would be a good time to add that low pressure gauge.



Old houses settle, it's not inconceivable that some settling has occurred and now the steam main or some of the radiator runout pipes are sloped the wrong way. Use a level and check all the pipes for proper slope. On a long pipe run use taut string to find any dips in the pipe.



Bob