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circulators burning out frequently

Lighteoflove
Lighteoflove Member Posts: 4
hi there

had an oil to gas conversion done last november with new boiler , circulators etc,  4 zones ( 3 for 3 previous zones and other to hwh); hot water heating; separate gas fired hwh; home on slab.

day after conversion, 1st floor main zone crculator burned out, no heat on main floor zone I.  installer came to change circulator and bleed pipe. month later, same thing, last month, no heat on 2nd floor zone II, same thing done. Zone III is apartment on first floor side of home.

Installer came, states I may have a leak in the main zone I slab which is making the circulator burn out and have no heat. No noticeable leaks, water bill indicates essentially same water usage. he also said there were water pressure changes and it dropped when he tested. we turned off all heat and are waiting for him to do some type of test on zone I main floor to detect possibl leak this week or later today.

Never had this problem pror to conversion/installation with circulators burning out dur to pipes needing to be bled often. House is 49 years old, copper pipes, on slab,

Any thoughts? Installer was recommended by National Grid and has always been cooperative and pleasant to come to home when called without charge thus far but i dont know exactly where th problem lies; leak in pipe or with the instalation process and/or equipment

Much thanks in advance for your help

Comments

  • Lighteoflove
    Lighteoflove Member Posts: 4
    ALSO....

    failed to mention that the installer has also put an addition valve in... which didnt seem to resolve the problem and ts baseboard heating/hot water.

    thanks!! :-)
  • Tim McElwain
    Tim McElwain Member Posts: 4,451
    What Make and Model is the boiler?

    Did they change any of the near boiler piping at the time of the install? If you know are the circulators on the return side of the boiler?
  • Lighteoflove
    Lighteoflove Member Posts: 4
    FOLLOWUP REPLY

    THX TIM

    BURNHAM 206 NIL -TE 12 GAS BOILER SERIES 2 MODEL B

    BURNHAM 50 G INDIRECT WATER STORAGE TANK

    PIPING NEAR BOILER APPEARS TO BE NEW

    CIRCULATORS ARE ON THE SAME SIDE OF THE BOILER ( LEFT) AS THEY WERE BEFORE CONVERSION/NEW UNIT INSTALLATION

    DONT KNOW IF THAT IS RETURN SIDE. HE IS CERTIFIED NATIONAL GRID INSTALLER
  • Tim McElwain
    Tim McElwain Member Posts: 4,451
    edited April 2012
    Some photos of

    your installation including circulators and piping would help.



    As far as a certified installer from national Grid all that means is he has a license.



    On a new system if proper installation was done and new piping installed along with circulators this should not be happening. A system should not need to keep being bled as a closed system does not let in air.
  • Lighteoflove
    Lighteoflove Member Posts: 4
    reply

    thc again Tim

    i will take some pics of the unit and piping/circulators and send those to you

    so you dont think it's due to a leaky pipe in the slab as the installer is adamant about?

    we just dont know what to do at this point and have been without heat for weeks ( thermostats turned down to 50 to prevent a fire from circulators burning out) per thr installer's advice.
  • Tim McElwain
    Tim McElwain Member Posts: 4,451
    Something is not right

    your installer has left you without heat for weeks. I would get someone from National Grid  to put some pressure on those folks.



    Was this system at one time a radiant system? Pipes in the slab could be leaking that is a possibility but there is testing that can be done to determine that. What is the pressure right now on the boiler gauge? It should be around 12 to 14 lbs pressure. Shut the water off to the boiler if there is a leak the pressure will drop. Then if there are isolating valves you can slowly eliminate each section.



    Do you have a low water cut-off on the boiler?



    What is your location? 
  • icesailor
    icesailor Member Posts: 7,265
    Burned Out:

    I think you have an electrical problem with the wiring polarity. I think you are somehow getting a hot neutral or a partially hot neutral.

    IMO, if it wasn't burning out circulators before the change, and immediately after the change you are, what changed? Wiring for one. 007's are one tough flock of birds.

    The installer is in over his head. You shouldn't be without heat for a day.

    Do you have any unusual situations with lights in the house? Like some brighter than others? Do some lights get brighter momentarily when an appliance comes on?
  • Empire_2
    Empire_2 Member Posts: 2,343
    Agree/

    Heat for 1 day or more is not acceptable.  At this point pictures would help as Tim stated, and I am wondering in pumps are dead heading on any particular zone, but still like stated above, takes a lot to burn these pumps out.  I too am looking at electrical problems.  A simple amp draw reading on the pumps when in operation would tell volumes.  You are in good hands here.  Would be nice if teleportation was possible, we'd be right over......lol  We eat this stuff up.



    Mike T.
  • gennady
    gennady Member Posts: 812
    edited April 2012
    pump

    if installer mounted cartridge type pumps vertically, and if there is spring loaded check valve on discharge, it traps air and can create situation with pump working with no flow.
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