Is it possible to close steam lines to part of building?

worlds_noisiest_radiators

I rent an office in an old multi-story building in Montreal that is heated by steam. Pipes and radiators are found on the north and the west walls of my office. The west ones are pretty quiet; the north wall ones are literally physically painful to hear. An ape beating the living daylights out of the radiator with a claw hammer couldn't make more noise.



The thing is, I'm pretty sure that the north wall radiators are unnecessary. Our building cooks all winter long. I had the north wall radiator off all last winter, and it was still too hot in here. I was thinking about addressing the noise problem by building an MDF enclosure around the rads and the pipes. But then I figured it might be worthwhile seeing if these north wall steam circuits could be shut down all together.



I could just ask the building owner, but he always just brushes me off: nothing can be done about these problems according to him. I figure if I was armed with a better understanding of the feasibility of shutting these down, I might be able to convince him.



So: <strong> is it likely that there is a valve in the mechanical room that controls the flow of steam to each circuit individually, such that these could be shut off? Or is there typically one valve for the whole building? Would shutting down these circuits have any negative or positive impacts on the operation of the system as a whole? </strong>



In case it enters the equation at all: our rads have two pipes, one with a valve entering at the top and another pipe leading away from the bottom. I'm guessing the former is the supply and the latter is the condensate return. But I am ignorant of these systems.



As a final question, <strong>I'm wondering if I would be right to argue that the incredible banging noise is likely to cause maintenance problems</strong>. I think that the valve on my north wall rad is leaking now, since there seems to be a little heat that gets across it, even though last year that didn't happen. If I tell the owner that he'll save himself maintenance money, maybe he'll take an interest.



Thanks to anyone who answers.

Steamhead

That's a Vapor system

and you probably have some bad traps on the radiators that are letting steam into the return lines. Post a pic of some rads to be sure, but I'm pretty certain that's what you have.



When does the banging start? Before or after the rads have heated up?

worlds_noisiest_radiators

Photo of offending rad

Thanks for your comment, Steamhead. Here is a photo of the rad.



Like I said, I have the valve on this rad fully closed all the time; it still makes noise. So in answer to your question of whether it makes noise before or after it warms up, I'm not really sure. My sense is that it makes noise when things are just getting warmed up, but I am not sure.



I'm not sure that it is helpful to diagnose the problem, because the building owner doesn't care. At most, I may be able to get him to turn these circuits off. Is this possible, would it solve the noise problem, and would this have any side-effects (good or bad) on the operation of the rest of the system?

nicholas bonham-carter

noisy, wasteful system

if the building owner would like to lower his cost of heating the building, then maybe a bit of long overdue maintenance could pay for itself in a month or so with savings of 30%.

it is ironic that these vapor systems were designed to be economical, and silent, and through lack of maintenance, this system has become neither silent nor economical!

has he ever heard the water-hammer himself, or simply heard of it?

the forces at work in water-hammer can be quite destructive, as well as alarming. is there a boiler inspection requirement in montreal to prevent a badly maintained boiler from suffering a catastrophe, and injuring someone? ask him if he minds if you call the fire department, or bomb squad the next time it is particularly severe.--nbc

Jamie Hall

Severe noise

Is not a characteristic of a properly operating steam system.  It is water hammer, and water hammer always -- always -- means something is amiss.



If this is one of those lovely older buildings I see around the city, odds are it has settled -- and the pipes with it, trapping water somewhere.  That water is going to bang.  It's also going to waste a lot of money.



Other possibilities include problems with the near boiler piping, particularly if a newer boiler was installed somewhere in the last 30 years or so.  That can get you water in your steam -- again, water hammer and a waste of money.



Or the pressure may simply be too high -- no more than 1 pound per square inch cutout should be ample; never more than 2.



And yes, cutting off the north side might help.  Might not, too.  And it isn't particularly likely that there is a handy valve, although it is possible.  One needs to be a bit wary of closing a handy valve, though, without really knowing how the rest of the system is piped -- it can make things worse. 



Noise from water hammer telegraphs in pipes, and can appear in radiators quite some distance from where the problem actually is.



Can you tell us a little more about the system?  Can you get into the boiler room and basement and look around some?  Some pictures, maybe?

worlds_noisiest_radiators

No more information available

Thanks for your helpful comments. Unfortunately, I do not have more information about the building heating system nor do I have access to the boiler room. I'm just a tenant.