R value for fieldstone walls

Novagen_Ed

We have a lot of old stone houses here in Eastern Pennsylvania.  I've never found a good "rule of thumb" for  what R value to use for this material when calculating heat loss.



As an example, my house has 22 inch thick sandstone walls in the main 3 story area.



The old timers just seemed to install  VERY large radiators, under windows..



.We're getting set to replace our  single pipe steam with panel radiators, to be fed from a mod / con boiler.



.

I'd appreciate any  thoughts and experience you can share.

Thanks

Ironman

If...

The cracks are sealed and there's no other finish, I'd figure it to be about the same as bare concrete. Maybe someone else has better engineering data they can share.

Novagen_Ed

Re: Fieldstone R value

Hi Ironman,

Thanks. Concrete is what I've substituted as the  material for these walls in my first heat loss calculations (and included the 3 coats of plaster on the interior surface).



Just wanted to be certain I wasn't missing anything....



Appreciate your input.

Ed

The Steam Whisperer (Formerly Boilerpro)

R-value

From the Ashrae fundamentals...Sand and limestone Rvalue is .08 per inch.

However, With high mass walls like that, I am sure they will be conducting a significant amount of heat out of the ground to moderate outdoor extremes, especially for the first floor,  so heat loads should probably be adjusted accordingly.

Too bad you're pulling out the steam.  When the power goes out there is alot less to worry about with steam..especially if you set up the system to operate without power.  While your nieghbors are all freezing you could be warm and toasty with a very efficient steam system.  Even if still connected to the grid, gas steam typically uses almost no power, so electrical operating costs are much lower than paying to run draft induction fans, pumps and powering control boards. The AFUE nubmers ignore this.   If you go to a modulating steam boiler/burner, you'll need to use some power, but that tied to TRV's in every room would give you a very efficient system.   And...smaller steam condensng boilers are probably just around the corner (there are already large ones)....the technology has been around for a long time. 

Novagen_Ed

mixed feelings ....

...about removing the steam:  we built  an addition with Warmboard subfloors, added propane , so the mod con boiler made sense.



( about 8 years ago I  found this terrific site while looking for information about maintaining my steam system).



The steam boiler  in the main house is a 12 year old Crown, has developed a leak by the tankless coil fitting , and is oil fired. ($$)



If there was a small modulating steam boiler available AND I could add TRVs to each radiator to smooth out the room to room heating it might be worth it, but the boiler is living on borrowed time and oil prices are not coming down, I suspect.



Thank You for your input, Boilerpro...



Ed

Steamhead

How small

is small? How much radiation do you have? 

The Steam Whisperer (Formerly Boilerpro)

There is a small modulating steamer

Power flame and Midco both make small modulating burners.  There are several control companies that make modulating burner controls.  I've set a couple of Slantfin Intrepids up with modulating burners. One at 200,000 max input and the other about 325,000.  The Powerflame is rated to go down to 35,000 or so input.  i believe the Midco is similiar.

Novagen_Ed

Radiator count

There are 6 rads total (originally 9 before renovation):



All are Crane, cast iron, flattened style sections.



I measured the dimensions of each section x number of sections:



First floor: 2 units, each 23 x 8 x 13/4  x 15 sections



Second floor: 1 unit is 17 x 8 x 13/4 x 16 sections



                         1 unit is 17 x 8 x 13/4 x 13 sections



Third floor: 2 units, each 35  x  6 x  1 1/2  x 8 sections



Thanks,  Steamhead

Ed

Novagen_Ed

Thanks

Boilerpro.

 I'll check  into those units; hadn't known modulating steam was available before posting here!

Thanks

Ed