Need Help!!

warren_4

I have tried to do all of the improvements, but can't get my system to stop throwing up water into the system.  This is throwing water up into my gauge and pressuretrol and it isn't shutting down the system.   The system runs until the radiator vents can't handle the pressure and start spitting/venting violently.  Here is what I have done so far:

1) Re-piped near boiler piping to manufacturer specs

2) Replaced pigtail and piping to gauges & replaced pressuretrol

3) Cold Skimmed it for 3 hours and flushed system about 8 times

The water is still a little dirty after a couple of days and bounces about 1-2 inches during operation.

<strong>Can you guys please give me some suggestions on what to do to get the system working properly?  Thanks a ton for your help!</strong>

nicholas bonham-carter

spitting

what is your pressure?

how many main vents do you have, and are they all working?--nbc

Steve_175

What size boiler

That is a big boiler, how many BTU's is it? Is this a single family, how big? What do your main vents look like?

Steamhead

Maybe

the new pressuretrol is bad? Or the wiring is wrong so it doesn't actually stop the burner? 

BobC

We need more information

Does the boiler shut off on pressure before the thermostat is satisfied?



What pressure is the pressuretrol set to? The front tab should be set to 0.5 (you can adjust it with the screw on top of the pressuretrol) and the internal dial should be on 1. That will let the boiler run between 0.5 and 1.5 PSI. Pressure higher than that just wastes fuel and magnifies whatever other problems you might have.



What does the pressure gauge read just before the boiler stops firing? If that is a 0-30 PSI gauge, they are not very good at low pressure.



Give us the make and model of that boiler. Also tell how many radiators it drives and what size each one is (height, width, depth, # of sections, # of columns per section). that information will let us determine if the boiler is matched to your load.



With that information we can start to figure out what is wrong.



Bob

gerry gill

is its firing rate

to hi? i've had to downfire many boilers to make them behave themselves..

warren_4

More Information

The boiler only will shut down with LWCO engages or thermostat is satisfied.  This is my second pressuretrol installed.   It is set a .5 and1.5psi for operation.  I have just ordered another pressure gauge because I have a 0-30 and will replace it with a more sensitive gauge.(when I blow into it the needle does move).   The gauge never registers pressure during boiler operation.  When I have removed it during operation, nothing but water shoots out of it.  



Boiler is a Utica PEG300 and is rated at 300,000 btu and 243,000 heating capacity MBH.  It heats a 1903 Georgian revival home in new jersey that is about 4700 sq ft with 3 stories.  We have 16 radiators of various sizes which I can measure if that would help (I can post later).  We have main vents on the wet return lines and they are gorton #2 I believe. 



Do you think I need to continue to skim it to stop the water being thrown up into the system.   Is this damaging/blocking the ability of the pressuretrol and gauge to work because it is full of water?



Thanks again for all your help... I have tried to read and teach myself as much as possible about steam, but I can't seem to get the system set.



Warren

nicholas bonham-carter

multiple skimmings needed?

one 3 hour skimming may not be adequate. when we installed our new boiler, i think i skimmed about 5 times. luckily there is a floor drain nearby, so with some temporary extensions to the skimming port, it did not require constant supervision, during each 4 hour period!

see if you can take the cover off the pressuretrol, and attempt to trip the lever inside, with a pencil, or other non-conductive tool, while the burner is on, to verify its basic function.

has the meter been clocked to show the btu's of gas used. if the gas valve has been adjusted incorrectly, you could be over-fired!

next verify your pressure at no more than 1.5 psi. a good low-pressure gauge [0-2 psi] would be more accurate, and show you whether your main vents were adequate to give a low back-pressure. on mine, during venting, the back-pressure is 1-2 ounces, and when the 17 gorton #2's, and 6 hoffman 75's close, the pressure will rise slowly to the 12 ounce cut-out [during really cold weather-brrrr!].--nbc

Jamie Hall

Couple of thoughts here...

First off, that pressuretrol, if it's set to 0.5 / 1.0, should shut off the boiler.  If it doesn't, there are three possibilities: the pigtail, or the pigtail port in the boiler, is blocked; the pressuretrol is defective; the pressuretrol is not wired correctly (it must be in series with the LWCO; I've seen them wired in parallel).  This will apply whether the boiler is making wet steam or bouncing or not.



I would add that that size boiler, in my humble opinion, should have at least two pressuretrols, or preferably two pressuretrols and a vapourstat.  Vapourstat set to whatever is right for the system -- less than a pound for vapour, 1.5 psi cutout for regular one pipe or two pipe.  If there is no vapourstat, pressuretrol number one set as close to 0.5 / 1.0 as you can.  If there is a vapourstat, try 2.0 / 1.0 (this will protect the vents and traps, if the vapourstat fails). Pressuretrol number two, which should be a manual reset type, should be set for about 5.0 psi cutout.  I'd also like to see two LWCOs.  The higher one could be hooked up to the automatic feeder, if you have one.  The lower one should again be a manual reset type.  All these gadgets should be in series.



These are all safety controls as well as operating controls.  Each one, individually, should turn off the boiler if they are tripped.  Check this.



On the pressure gauge.  Code requires you to have one pressure gauge rated to twice the safety valve rating of your boiler -- typically that would be a 0 to 30 psi gauge.  Normally there is nothing to prevent you, however, from putting a low pressure gauge on with a T to the vapourstat or number one pressuretrol.

warren_4

Any other suggestions?

I guess the two things for me to do are:

1) Skim for half a day minimum (will do next Saturday when wife is out shopping so she won't complain!!)

2) Check to make sure the boiler is not over-fired - Any ideas on how to do this?

The pigtail is clear and the pressuretrol is wired correctly (took cover off and tripped it manually while boiler was on and it worked).  Anything else that I can do to stop wet steam and ensure the boiler is working properly? 

Thanks for all the suggestions and hopefully with your help, I will get this old house heated up nicely!!



Warren