Steam distribution pipe layout

homeowner03

My home was recently renovated.  In order to accommodate a change in the first floor layout, the feeder pipe (riser?) to a second floor radiator was re-routed.  The feeder comes off the main line horizontally about 2 feet, runs vertically about 4" through an "s" shaped curve, runs 2 feet back toward and beyond the main supply, before running vertically to the second floor radiator.  The "s" shaped turn was installed to allow the pipe to clear two water supply lines to a nearby bathroom.  I've uploaded pictures of the "s" shaped pipe to give a better sense of the layout.

I'm wondering if there is anything inherently wrong with this "s" shaped curve in the feeder pipe.  It strikes me as rather inefficient.  We've noticed the radiator that it feeds is slow to heat up.  The primary cause, I believe, is a leak in one of the joints in the "s" shaped pipe which is allowing condensate (and presumably steam) to escape.  Before the HVAC contractor returns to re-sweat the pipe, I'm wondering if I need to have him redesign the transition from the main line to the vertical pipe (in other words, eliminate the "s" curve).

Any suggestions are welcome.

BobC

modified piping

It is very important that the pipe is sloped so any water can flow back to the boiler, if the pipe is not sloped correctly the radiator will be slow to heat and could start suffering from water hammer.



Bob

nicholas bonham-carter

snakey pipe

make sure that the pitch is as perfect as possible, and in the future, use iron pipe as it will have a longer life.

the leaking joints you now have are only the beginning of your problems with copper pipe, so make sure you have a warranty from the installer longer than a couple of years.

unfortunately, the temerature swings in a steam system make copper pipes very iffy because of the sweated joints, and there inability to "give" into torsional stress.--nbc

homeowner03

distribution pipe continued

Unfortunately, the old work was copper so the installer had to work with what was existing.  He used steel for the new vertical line to the radiator, but had to transition back to the copper main.

Is it possible to maintain the right pitch with so many turns in the pipe?

BobC

Slope

Steam will flow almost anywhere it can but water can only drain back if the slope is correct. If that pipe is not sloped right it will just pool water and not work correctly. The S curve is not really a problem (it does mean the pipe is effectively lengthened but that is not usually critical) unless it causes pitch problems.



A way has to be found to correct a problem like that and it isn't going to be easy. Any chance you could move the radiator? Maybe you could raise the radiator to make it possible to get that supply pipe pitched correctly.



Bob

homeowner03

the right slope

Thanks for the feedback.  I took another look at the supply pipe coming off the main.  It definitely slopes towards the riser and away from the main.  The space is tight, but there should be room to adjust the pipe so that it pitches in the right direction.  The biggest challenge will be to convince the contractor that the pipe needs to be re-run; rather than simply repairing the leaky joint on a pipe pitched the wrong direction.

Thanks again.

homeowner03

addendum

I just realized the pictures I posted are rotated 90 degrees.  If you rotate them clockwise 90 degrees you'll get a truer sense of which direction they run (still pitched toward the riser and away from the main), however.

Oak Park Electric

Copper switchback

Without having done this myself, or being there to see it, I am going to say I think there has to be another way to do it.  It *looks* like that whole loop that comes toward the camera at the bottom and goes back at the top is really unnecessary.  It also seems to be pitched down at the u turn.  This will collect water and cause future problems.  The reason the radiator is not heating is not because of a leak, but it may be because the pipe is full of water.  I would definitely try to find a more direct route for this thing, and eliminate all that roundabout.  If you want a really good opinion, post some more pictures so we can get a better idea of what is off in the distance at the far end of the current views.  Hope this helps