programmable thermostat, steam radiators

sg_4

hi there.
we're trying to decide if we should put a programmable thermostat in our apt that has steam radiators. it seems like the "intelligent recovery" feature of some will factor in the slow response time. but other things i've read make it sound like this is a waste of time.
i apologize if this is answered somewhere else. thanks for your help!

Steamhead (in transit)

If your system responds slowly

have that fixed first. Then you can use a programmable stat much more effectively.

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David Nadle

Will you set back?

Intelligent recovery will do a good job getting your rooms to the right temperature at the end of the setback period. It won't make your steam system respond faster. It will just start a cycle earlier or later as needed.

Mark Custis

What does the thermostat control?

Your space?

The entire building?

sg_4

hi. thanks for all this. the thermostat controls our apt; each apt has its own boiler according to my landlord. as you can imagine i don't have much control over actually fixing the slow response problem. partly the prog therm would be to deal with that and partly to avoid forgetting to turn it down at night or during the day.
thanks!

David Nadle

Interesting

What kind of steam boiler is sized for an individual apartment? Can you post a pictre? Also, can you put some numbers behind this "slow response?" Are you referring to the length of time it takes to recover from a setback, or the time it takes for the radiators to get hot following a call for heat?

If you have been manually turning your thermostat down and up, and the system is working well except for a long wait for the room temperature to recover, then by all means get the programmable thermostat.

sg_4

i have no idea about the size of the boiler; i don't have access to it. the situation is that the landlord agreed to install the prog therm if we buy it. but if i'm going to invest in this, i want it to be worth it. the response issue is, yes, it takes about 45 min to an hour to heat up to the set temp, and another hour at least to turn off after reaching the set temp. so the set temp is 60, the therm shows 70, and the radiators are only beginning to cool down.

David Nadle

From where?

It takes 45 - 60 minutes to recover how many degrees, at what outdoor temperature? How well does the system work if you leave it at 68?

Ten degrees overshoot is a lot. Could your present thermostat be faulty, or in a bad location (outside wall, drafty spot, etc.)?

"Worth it" means something different to everyone but if it were my apartment and I was happy with the system performance at maintaining a single temperature, I'd try a new thermostat as an experiment. Less expensive in the long run than adding ten degrees unwanted heat every day.

Are you paying the heating bill? If so I think you should have a right to inspect the boiler.

Jamie Hall

Yike

That kind of overshoot is a bit extreme... to put it mildly. You don't say what the existing thermostat is, but if it one of the older ones which need an anticipator setting, that could be it. Having said that, a new programmable (but get a good one -- don't go big box cheap!) will help, pretty darn near guaranteed.

On the subject of setback, there's been a lot of discussion on that -- and the best consensus seems to be that setting a steam/cast iron radiator system back more than about 5 degrees F is going to use more energy in the recovery than you'll save from the setback.

To give you an idea on times when things are working well: my place, some 7,000 sq. ft. heated area, recovers from a 5 degree setback in about 20 minutes from when steam hits the radiators with an outside temperature of 30; at 0 it takes about 23 minutes. No overshoot to speak of with a Honeywell VisionPro...

sg_4

Thank you all for your help. It sounds like there is no reason NOT to get a programmable thermostat, and the best case will be that it helps immensely. I've had the Honeywell 6000 recommended to me, so that's probably what we'll get. I don't know if you're allowed to recommend a product, but maybe someone can warn me if this is a bad choice?

Thanks again, this was super helpful.