Any reason NOT to always use full port ball valves?

Rich Kontny_4

Nibco.com has a very informative website about proper application of their products relative to type of use and what you want the valve to do. They also offer their "MasterSpec" software for proper selection/application.

The only negative I have encountered with ball valves is here tendency to seize if not usd a a regular basis.Ideally they should be operated several times a year to keep the seals loose.

Years ago "Apollo Valve" introduced ball valves and changed our way of thinking relative to fluid and gas control.

Rich K.

D107

for both heating and plumbing

Full port avoids pressure drop, yes?

Is there such a thing as a full port gate valve?

Thanks,

David

Unknown

Only...

if you don't want your system to run so good?

Brad White

Conventional or Reduced Port

ball valves are a little more compact and afford a slight restriction which may be desirable for balancing. (Balancing that way with a ball valve is old-hat, so to me that is a thin argument.)

The only reason besides modest space conservation to use a reduced port ball valve is for purging and venting where you want the added velocity. Otherwise, full port all the way.

D107

thanks, very interesting that reduced port can purge better

For a layman like me, it's almost counterintuitive--I'd automatically think wider valve, more flow but it's the velocity I forgot about--at least for purging.

I'll get hold of that hydraulics 101 someday.

Thanks,

David

Brad White

Of course the purging point

is almost academic if you have large old gravity HW pipes. You still have to entrain the air with the flow if you cannot vent it vertically.

That sudden nice pressure drop when the velocity increases almost creates a relative vacuum, an added incentive as air moves from high to low pressure. I would submit that a full port valve will do as well provided you have enough flow coming in -from a good hose. Minor point in the scheme of things.

Paul Pollets

Or...

a Globe valve is used in a boiler or system bypass, rather than a ball valve.

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RJ_4

I agree on the use of a red. port ball valve for purging. Using a ball valve for balancing is not ideal, leaving the valve in a partially closed position is not good for the teflon seal rings. Should use a balancing (circut setter). Agreeing with Paul P. Proportional control is acheived by using a globe style valve.

Long Beach Ed

I was taught...

That a ball valve should not be used for throttling flow. Like a gate valve, it should be turn fully open or fully closed.

Otherwise, the passing stream would wear the walls of the ball.

But I throttle them anyway.

bob_50

B&G,Watts

etc. use ball valves in their circuit setters. Youse guys better tell them about not throttling a ball valve. The only reason I can think of for not useing a full port is cost.

JJ_4

Ball valves for balancing

In commercial temp controls the mechanical contractors use ball valves at the VAV box re-heat coils for balancing flow to specifications. Then control valves (globe, contoured ball, Erie "flapper" style, etc.) with a Cv matched to the coil are used for the temp control application. I have seen nothing else in over 10-years.

Brad White

You have not been working on my jobs, have you?

I am bullish on good water flow management. My default design standard is a Macon or Tour and Andersson multi-turn Y-Pattern balancing valve. Very precise...

Ball or butterfly valves are binary- you have flow or you do not

Too much or too little flow with minute adjustments. Goldilocks becomes your balancing contractor...

I agree, the use of ball valves (yes, even with memory stops) is common, way too much so. As a result we are moving an awful lot of water we do not have to and suffering delta-T issues on the equipment side.

My $0.02

Brad

Jamie Hall

and may I add

having found out the hard way -- there is a very good reason NOT to use reduced port ball valves on low pressure (or vapour) saturated steam: the pressure drop through the reduced port will condense a substantial fraction of your steam, and you've got no heat... (saturated steam is funny stuff).

hvacfreak

Gas

> having found out the hard way -- there is a very

> good reason NOT to use reduced port ball valves

> on low pressure (or vapour) saturated steam: the

> pressure drop through the reduced port will

> condense a substantial fraction of your steam,

> and you've got no heat... (saturated steam is

> funny stuff).

hvacfreak

Gas and LP

I wonder why the AGA valves always seem to be reduced port. Makes no sense to me.

As far as fluid , I see no good reason why anything else would ever be made. Perhaps manufacturing limitations early on ?

And better balancing valves are globe type. Thinking T&A type with the red knob. I've seen the cheap ball type balancing valves , and they are a COMPROMISE from the IDEAL. - M

RJ_4

Balance valves

The difference is Bell&Gosset or T&A or whatever make, are precision engineered valves, the smaller valves do employ ball valve construction but are designed different than regular ball valves. they also have have test ports to hook up a circut setter meter (B&G RO-4). the larger flange valves employ globe valve construction. A properly installed VAV system needs circut setters on the reheat coils to acheive a properly balanced system.

Chris_82

Right on target Bob,...

Cost.

We did (some really big building) with the circuit setters, over a thousand of them, what a headach getting the right settings. But once the flow is right the heat was very appreciated, and the whole building was kept in a ready state by one Taco 110. This was on a bypass heat system in a 80 story highrise to keep the piping warm. After the job we found out that Conabraco (spelling) would have provided services upon demand. Anyways quality ball valves last longer, but we have noticed they last even longer if someone cycles them open and shut once a year.