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no main vents; no condensate pump

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paul_56
paul_56 Member Posts: 6
in THE MAIN WALL
I have a 2-pipe system. I have no main vents.
I have no condensate pump. I have traps on the ends
of my return lines and all radiators.

The system was extended around 1987 to add 4 radiators
(2 down, 2 up) on a 2-story addition. (11 rads total)

The 7 radiators in the original part of the house heat
fine. I have some pretty severe water hammer -- but only
in the new addtion raditors. The worst is the upstairs
one furthest from the boiler.

I bought Dan's book and read it. My contractor came;
I asked him to find my main vents and he could not.

Now we know that I know as much as he does. He said
he needed to consult with a "more senior" tech from his
company. (Hope he isn't dead, too!)

I think the boiler it sending wet steamm it's getting
trapped in the main for the addition's 4 radiators,
and banging like hell at the end of the riser.
(The boiler is 30 years old and precedes the addition.)

What can I do? Should I get vents installed first?

Th knucklehead contractor wants to tear apart my kitchen
ceiling just to confirm the pipe isn't galvanized.

Comments

  • gerry gill
    gerry gill Member Posts: 3,084
    do you have a pipe

    originating from the return piping system and going into the chimney? many Mouat 2 pipe vapor systems did this and it works very well..look for a pipe you can't identify as being from a radiator..

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
    gwgillplumbingandheating.com
    Serving Cleveland's eastern suburbs from Cleveland Heights down to Cuyahoga Falls.

  • paul_56
    paul_56 Member Posts: 6
    return into chinmeny


    I don't. All returns come back to the boiler.
  • gerry gill
    gerry gill Member Posts: 3,084
    air's getting out somewhere.

    or there wouldn't be any heat.

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
    gwgillplumbingandheating.com
    Serving Cleveland's eastern suburbs from Cleveland Heights down to Cuyahoga Falls.

  • T-O
    T-O Member Posts: 29


    Like Jerry said, air must be getting out somewhere otherwise you would have no heat. On a two pipe (with traps) system the mains do not have air vents. The vent(s) will be on the return side. From the boiler follow the return pipe working your way toward the main(s) trap(s)and also checking the returns from the radiators. Use a good flashlight if necessary to help around dark concealed areas.
    T-O
  • paul_56
    paul_56 Member Posts: 6
    bucket trap

    I can only see one inverted bucket trap coming off
    the header. There is no main vent at all.

    In the attached image -- the circles are the (2) return lines.

    The square is the bucket trap. As far as I know, this is the only means by which the system is breathing.
  • Steamhead (in transit)
    Steamhead (in transit) Member Posts: 6,688
    You just found what you're looking for

    The device in the square is the air vent, taking the shape of a "Float trap/air eliminator". There is a small vacuum check in the top and this is where the air escapes (this check should be removed, it can cause distribution problems on oil or gas firing).

    At the end of each steam main is a radiator trap, which vents air into the dry return from which it escapes thru the FT/AE.

    You have a Vapor system- is it a Dunham?
  • paul_56
    paul_56 Member Posts: 6
    hallelujah

    It is indeed a Dunham!

    What should I remove? I still have hammering in the
    4 radiators in the addition and lurching when the
    system first fires up. (See my original question
    above.)

    Note that this system is in Northern California,
    so it's not that cold here [the system only fires
    about 3 times in 12 hours] and it's that much harder
    to find a pro.

    (No sympathy from east coaster, I'm sure. But I
    grew up there!)
  • paul_56
    paul_56 Member Posts: 6
    p.s.


    Thank you, Steamhead!

    I will research the end-of-main radiator traps. Is suspect one is there on the original main but not the one added to feed the 4 rads in the additon added in 1987.

    Maybe my boiler is overfiring for vapor, also..
This discussion has been closed.

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