TT Prestige Solo 110 Potential Replacement
So I have a 110 installed about 12 yrs ago. Was going to have the CO recall done today but when the tech arrived, he indicated to me that the venturi gas flow meter had some issues. He put his finger inside the tube, it came out black and sooty when he removed his finger.
He had some concerns about moving forward with the recall work, something to do with needing to potentially needing to adjust the flow meter afterwards and being unable to do that successfully.
I am going to try to replace the meter but there are concerns as to availability of parts.
He raised the prospect of replacing the boiler with a Lochinvar which I'm naturally not too excited about. Curious what you all think?
Comments
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My experience is that the venturi is often shedding blackness, especially for a 12 year old boiler. But just in case, I would see if there's any chance exhaust gases are being sucked back into the boiler which causes deterioration/failure of the venturi.
By flow meter, I assume you mean the gas valve? Adjustment of gas valve shouldn't be a concern. I'd be suspicious that he didn't have a combustion analyzer or didn't know how to use one. No one should adjust or replace the gas valve without a combustion analyzer.
8.33 lbs./gal. x 60 min./hr. x 20°ΔT = 10,000 BTU's/hour
Two btu per sq ft for degree difference for a slab
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Does he sound like he was a salesman dressed in mechanics clothing? With Carbon monoxide recall repairs I would expect dome soot to be on the burner parts. Call the recall line and ask about this technician and see if there might be another technician that can come to do the work.
Edward Young Retired
After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?
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Hmmm, I'm not really sure… he did raise the topic shortly after arriving, for whatever that might indicate.
I don't recall exactly what he said about how the venturi might fail but just that it could leave me with a non-functioning boiler. If I am understanding you correctly, you are saying that the nature of the CO issues would result in soot due to the improper/incomplete combustion?
I believe that he was referring to the device that regulates the gas flow into the combustion chamber. Called it the venturi which I thought was a type of flow measurement device.
He didn't mention any combustion analysis, maybe he didn't get to that point.
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I had the recall done on mine and now am getting failed ignitions sometimes between a dhw and heating calls. I am in the same boat of possibly having to replace sooner rather than later.
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Venturi questions? There is a part without a part number, just a size -002. That is the section of the air intake where the gas valve will add fuel to the combustion air based on the speed of the combustion blower motor. the faster the blower motor turns, the more gas and combustion air will be forced into the burner to burn in the combustion chamber.
Soot in that location might be a problem since that location is before there is any flame. Seems like a place where there should be no soot. I wonder if that is the reason for the recall. Delayed ignition is causing CO to enter the home. That sounds like the flame may be forced out of the venture backwards as a result of the delayed ignition. Too much fuel in the small combustion chamber will look to escape in all directions, the exhaust, the inlet, and any gaskets that may be suspect like the condensate trap.
If the proper adjustments are not made during the procedure, then you may end up with the failed ignition problem described by @wrxz24 .
With this information I can only recommend that you get a second person that is authorized to make the recall repairs and see if you can get ALL of the kits (I think there are 4) installed on your boiler. If that turns out to be a hassle, then you may be better off with a new boiler. But I would go with another contractor. Look for the smaller plumbing and heating company. the guy that has his name on the side of the truck, not some national franchise company. They always have higher prices because they have higher overhead, and they employ salesmen dressed in mechanics clothing. That is just my opinion from having competitors that have signed up for those national franchises.
Edward Young Retired
After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?
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PSRKIT81 for the prestige 110 venturi. will need to adjust combustion with an analyzer after installing.
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There are 4 recalls? What are those for? I'm not seeing anything on their website?
Incidentally, this is a small local installer that is family-owned - definitely not a national franchise.
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If that installer/contractor is of the Mom & Pop variety, and you trust them, Then it may be time for a new boiler. This recall may have a lot to do with the reason that Triangle Tube closed their doors last year. It is hard to recover from this kind of thing
Another boiler manufacturer may be the best choice at this time. I was just afraid that you may have had a larger franchise HVAC dealer. It sounds like you may have the right people with the best advise here.
Edward Young Retired
After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?
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It's hard to know if you can trust someone, I haven't worked with them - only familiar with them because TT recommended them for recall work. My regular HVAC (which was a local but was acquired a time ago by a larger group) didn't want anything to do with TT's hoops for the recall
The company for the recall recommended Lochinvar and one other brand that I can't recall (maybe Viessman?)
I think that I am going to try and get the venturi replaced if needed as the cost the tech mentioned was relatively low, especially compared to a new boiler.
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Tough situation. I have not personally worked on Lochinvar or Viessmann products during my 50 years in the trade before retirement. Both brands are well respected on this website and in the industry.
That said, like anything else, the installing contractor is the key to a quality job. The best-made product, if installed by an inexperienced or unqualified professional, can become a nightmare. On the other hand, even a less sophisticated product that is installed properly can end up being one of the most trouble-free systems you’ll ever have.
In the end, proper design, installation, and setup matter just as much — if not more — than the name on the equipment.
Bottom line: Choose the best contractor, not the best equipment. I liked Crown Boiler. but others liked Weil McLain in my area. Lochinvar and Viessman were available however there were very few who installed them.
Edward Young Retired
After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?
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The 2025 recall is the most important one. The kit contains a replacement circuit board, ignition transformer, igniter, heat exchanger gasket/insulation, trap retainer and in some case, exhaust pipe replacement and keypad circuit board. After replacing the parts, there's a rigorous combustion analysis. The process takes me 3 hours; YMMV.
I'm still suspicious that your technician - for some other reason - was not comfortable with the process. A blackened "venturi gas flow meter" is not a valid reason to skip the procedure. And a venturi is not a meter. It's for air flow, not gas.
8.33 lbs./gal. x 60 min./hr. x 20°ΔT = 10,000 BTU's/hour
Two btu per sq ft for degree difference for a slab0 -
Perhaps I misunderstood what he said.
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do you know where I can purchase the updated igniter?
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In addition to the igniter with harness, you would need the items to support it: An ignition transformer and an upgraded circuit board.
Before the recall, you could purchase the upgrade kit - I believe PTRKIT301 is the part number - but it was all included free of charge in the upgrade kit which your technician received for your boiler.
8.33 lbs./gal. x 60 min./hr. x 20°ΔT = 10,000 BTU's/hour
Two btu per sq ft for degree difference for a slab0 -
Any particular brand recommendations for replacement?
I am thinking either Viessmann or Lochinvar.
As mentioned, I have a PT110 now that modulates 30-110 kBTU/hr which short-cycles badly when a single zone is calling (it's been a while since I measured them but my recollection is that my zones are ~15k/15k/25k BTU/hr at 180F baseboard temp). About 8-9 yrs ago, I was able to patch the short-cycling issue by jumpering the two smaller zones together. Ideally, I'd like to be able to undo that jumpering and allow each to run independently.
I also have a SMART80 DHW storage tank and have been told that it's the reason that I have the PT110.
The DHW tank is currently set to 136F with a 12F differential and heats with 166F (30F adder) boiler water. I was able to capture some readings from the boiler (only 15 min intervals, unfortunately) but for two showers earlier today where the boiler recovered 100% btw them, it took 60-90 min (low of 96F) and 48-60 min (low of 100F).
Another 100 kBTU is being recommended, hesitant about that due to the short-cycling issue. Although, the 10:1 turndown that these boilers have may make it OK.
Thoughts?
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