Replacing pressure reducing valve
hello techs , recently worked on boiler had to pipe in relieve valve to bldg drain, found PRV leaking causing system to lose pressure, the location of the prv is tight no space to work , I want to relocate the new prv & back flow preventer so it accessible for future repalcments ,i.ll share job pics any suggestions would be great,
as the job looks simple.
Comments
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Sure, a combo package makes that easy.
Replace that pressure relief also.
Is that a LWC with no wires connected? :)
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream0 -
I like the combo units also. They come with a union fitting so you don't need to cut pipes to replace the parts in the future. If you pipe it near the expansion tank and include an isolation valve on both sides of the setup, you can service the expansion tank, back flow preventer and auto feed PRV without draining the boiler or shutting off the house’s potable water supply. This Expansion Tank Fitting on one end and that ball valve on the other end will accomplish this nicely.
Edward Young Retired
After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?
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Looks like you are pumping into the boiler? Air purger and expansion on the supply side of the boiler?
An upgrade would be to connect a tee above that pump, tie the tank and fill valve there.
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream0 -
If I repiped this one it might look like this
Edward Young Retired
After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?
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Or this option.
Above the pump, below the yellow ball valve is a coupling. Remove that, install a tee with 1/2 branch. Tank and fill connect there.
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream0 -
Are we going to address the discharge piping on the relief valve?
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I had plans to do something other than addressing all of the issues in those pictures tonight. It would be easier to cut everything back to where it comes out of the house and the boiler and start over than to try to fix what is there.
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yes its pumping into the boiler, air purger & expansion on supply side. i.ll visit the job again & evaluate the upgrade to owner boiler poorly maintained over the years ,thank you for your time.
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I replaced the pressure relieve valve & tead boiler 1 & 2 relieve valve into floor draine ,LWC is not even connected ,I initially came in May to help stop relieve valve leaking water on boiler 1 & left job for September due to hvac season, looks like ex-tank full of water i cant even press the air pen to test it , poor maintenance & safetys bypassed by unprofessionals just to make few bucks & runaway ,am going to fix all issues i.ll share pics of the piping on the releive valve .thank you for looking in.
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well, we have seen worse🧐
What type of heat emitters?
I’d wonder about the dirt or corrosion particles on top if the jacket. How does the burner tray look?
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream0 -
baseboard heat, boiler needs complete cleaning to make it simple.
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thanks for drawing it out for me ,it make things much easier, as I am hvac guy that works on air conditioning, most of the time.
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I aprecaite taking the time to draw this out for me ,makes job go much easier & practicle.
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so am pumping away from the ex.tank , in this setup
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To check the expansion tank, push in the tire stem "needle" or sometimes shake or rattle the tank to see if it is water logged.
Often on neglected systems it is best to price all the safeties or "consumables"
Fill and BFD, relief, LWC, expansion tank. The cost of these items is probably much cheaper that repeated call backs to find yet another failed component.
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream0 -
Tire stem would not move looks like its water logged , owner already gave me the green light to repair the boiler so price shouldn't be issue ,thanks again
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sounds like you are trying to do right by the owner. Keep checking in. Someone usually has an answer
Or @EdTheHeaterMan will make something up🤓
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream
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man you guys are great ,very knowledgeable & helpfull , GOD BLESS
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"so price shouldn't be issue"
Famous Last Words!
I will suggest that you price all the components @hot_rod suggested, including the labor to install them as a single flat rate for the complete job. It will come to a high price that you will propose to the owner. Then you can do an individual price for each component separately. those will al be lower of course but when you add up the individual prices the total will be much higher when completed separately. This approach will usually get the entire job completed up front, with the approval of the customer knowing what the price is going to be up front. Then you don't have a problem collecting after you are done because "I didn't think it was going to be that much" after the job is completed. Then you get to spend more time that you don't get to add to the bill in order to reduce the bill for what is already completed.
Edward Young Retired
After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?
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I looked at the After Photo and might make this observation. Your solution might be in violation ANSI Z21.22, and I'm sure you did not intend to do that.
In Accordance with ANSI Z21.22 No valve is to be placed between the safety relief valve and the tank. A discharge line shall be connected to the outlet of the valve and shall pitch downward from the valve. Discharge line shall terminate through plain (unthreaded) pipe with at least a 6” (152mm) air gap from building drain or other approved location where any discharge will be clearly visible. In no case may a discharge line be directly connected to a sewer line. No reducing coupling or other restriction shall be installed in the discharge line. The discharge line shall be installed to allow complete drainage of both the valve and the line. Discharge line material must conform to local plumbing codes or ASME requirements. Excessive length over 30’ (9.14m), use of more than four elbows, or reducing discharge line size will cause a restriction and reduce the discharge capacity of the valve
You can find this information on just about every relief valve tag that is supposed to be left in place after the valve is installed. Here is a typical tag:
This photo represents a situation where the discharge is not visible with a minimum of 6" air gap and where it is directly connected to a sewer drain pipe.
Edward Young Retired
After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?
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I also wonder why there was a trap in that drain and there isn't one now.
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Washing machine discharge?!? maybe
I might suggest this design. include all the relief valves for each boiler and water heater. Try not to use more than four 90° elbows.
A trap on the drain line may also be necessary.
Edward Young Retired
After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?
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I would say yes i do agree on the pricing formullah you provided was good. checking the job after its done does take up time.
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there was a washing machine in past not sure if photo can show there's still hot & cold water lines which are not used.
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If that drain goes to a sewer it needs a trap.
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yes indeed i did not intend piping to sewer line to do fast job ,that's why am sharing the job photos,to execute the job professionally & upto code i.ll have to correct the relief piping , I do have the 2 boiler relieve valves tead together which I would have to redue.
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is it possible the white pvc just sits over a floor drain that is trapped? If so that is an indirect waste, and legal.
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream2 -
there is no floor draine in the boiler room ,the pvc travels towards the basement bathroom erea & not sure where it ends ,mostliky bldg drian system .
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I can add my own trap on the white pvc before the open funnel. as pictured.
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Edward Young Retired
After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?
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but if there is already a trap on the line, you don’t want a second trap
Find where that line ends up. If in fact you add a trap, by code and for proper operation it needs to be vented
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream1 -
(depending on where it goes it might be wet vented)
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