Boiler Header Manifold
Anyone familiar with this brand boiler header manifold? Price is so low it almost worried me a bit. I’ve used legend before and it’s a great product but happen to come across this so figured I’d check to see if anyone has a quality report from experience
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Probably China. I am sure it is fine if the welder knew how to weld.
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As long as there is not too much Chinesezium in the welding rod used.
Edward Young Retired
After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?
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i'd be more concerned about the pipe and the threads which aren't mutually exclusive
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the welds were actually what I was most concerned about. The pipe has to be up to some kind of standard lol but of course the threads could be no good which then you’re screwed either way
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its not like someone is inspecting the factory to see if it meets those standards
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From a warehouse in E Brooklyn?
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream0 -
yeah Pex Warehouse is right by Marine Park
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i assume it is made in china at that price. it looks like it is distributed by one of a number of companies that curtiss-wright acquired over the past 20 years
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I've used them several times with good results. With that said, be very careful with that company. I used to spend tens of thousands per year there and while they were usually okay, the instances where they'd ship the wrong item or skip something in the order was like pulling teeth to get a resolution. Customer service is beyond horrible and the supervisor is downright insane- always blaming the customers for the company's faults. We're currently involved in a legal battle where they took payment for a several thousand dollar order and never sent it out.
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can't you usually just claim something like that with your credit card company?
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Id be surprised if it is even schedule 40?
i think the original Speedy Header brand were made in the US.
Earth Lee was another custom made brand
Sioux Chief, Alberta T drill and Precision Hydronics have copper headers available
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream0 -
are you talking about out Pex Universe? Luckily they have a store like 15 minutes from my house if there is any issues
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According to the description its schedule 40
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supplyhouse.com shows 2 different brands, one that is like $40 and one that is like $120. there could be many reasons for the lower price, many of which may have nothing to do with the actual product, but one might be made in china.
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yeah def assume China they were cheap enough I could order them, take a look a see the quality. If they looks no bueno, bring them back no harm
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We used BASCO on Long Island in the 1980s & 1990s…Excellent & reasonable. Haven't seen them in years. The biggest issue I've seen with the cheap imports is not the welds, but the branches not being 100% plumb with eachother…skewed....Mad Dog
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Far be it from me to second guess people motives, tendencies and persuasions, but why not install a quality brass manifold with individual shutoff valves, union connections and flow meters (Roth, Rehau, Uponor…..). Will it really break the bank?
8.33 lbs./gal. x 60 min./hr. x 20°ΔT = 10,000 BTU's/hour
Two btu per sq ft for degree difference for a slab
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there are certainly good , better, best pricing and products out there.
For manifolds, cast or forged brass from Italy is tops, stainless or plain copper stubs next level, and no name steel import may be the lowest price.
Even with a jig metals move when welded or brazed. I struggled with this when making copper T Drill manifolds by hand. Luckily a copper braze leaves you with a “movable” branch😉
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream0 -
because the feed/return header is being done in Black pipe. Then there will be isolation flanges on both sides of every circulator. The one radiant loop will indeed have a mixing valve & an Uponor radiant manifold, the rest of the house is baseboard
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Yes
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so little update, they are def schedule 40, but very inconsistent.
5 Zone all the welds look good(IMO) 3/4 stub outs were straight but the pipe itself had a bow in itThe 2&3 Zone was straight but unfortunately the welds did not look great to me.
So I won’t be using them, doesn’t seem like a bad product, just very inconsistent like many mentioned
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The bow in the pipe is due to heat from welding the nipples. I'm having an issue with my welder installing 1-1/2 threadolets on 4" schedule 40 steel. I'm having them installed with 8" spacing's. He's having me buy schedule 80 to handle the heat and he's going to run water thru it to keep it cool.
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I have had that issue. They make nice skis when your done. Never tried the water trick.
Only way I ever found was to heat the 4" to relive the stress. Putting the tapping on opposite sides of the pipe would help balance things out but you can't always do that.
Instead of using thread-o-lets they make pipe-o-lets which are much lighter and have less mass and don't require as much weld metal so you get less shrinkage
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can you move along the manifold doing about 1/8 of each fitting at a time and still end up with a good weld? i assume you have to tack them square first
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@EBEBRATT
I'm doing the threadolets so I can bush them down to what I need and if I need to increase the pipe size for a particular zone for whatever reason I'm not locked into the small size. I like to keep my options opened. Once its welded, it's welded if you know what I mean.
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the two dimensions that need to be kept in tolerance are the branches square or 90 degrees to the trunk
Then the axial tolerance , looking down the trunk, from an end, do they all plumb to one other.
The farther away you pipe from the branch, the more noticeable any variance will be
We have run into this with hydraulic separators that we weld. If they put long trunks on the outlets, even a tiny out of tolerance on the branch weld position to show
Warping of the trunk in to an arc is yet another concern, but the easiest to correct
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream0 -
The only other option that I could even remotely think about doing with was mechanical tees and I don't think that is a very professional looking manifold.
propress and Megapress is not an option not only due to cost but you are not guaranteed a straight piece of pipe either.
a tee puller we don't have plus time consuming.
so I have faith in my welders to keep it straight. 🙏
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Unfortunatly metal shrinks after welding and weld o lets are heavy and take a lot of heat and a lot of passes.
You can clamp the pipe down and tack the pipe to a strong back and it will still warp. In fact it will just break the tacks.
Stress releafe with heat is my only trick.
I know you want to keep your options open on branch pipe size but the larger the weldo let the more warp you get.
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Could tig vs mig vs stick make a big difference here? Unless it is steam or there is a spec requiring black if you are doing it for cost copper with the right t drill is probably the least expensive over several installations. Doing it with black fittings and nipples is definitely an art and making that look good is definitely a professional job.
Not really sure what you're trying to accomplish with this.
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Just trying to do a professional job that's all. Customer is paying six figures for a boiler room and I think he wants a six figure professional job in return.
And I'm not hiding it with insulation lol. The old Weil McLain 1086 supplied all the heat for the basement by just sitting.
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US made black fittings would be my first choice if it were mine. Copper would be my second. Leave a capped tee on the end and space to add more zones if needed. A caleffi hydraulic separator makes a nice job for air and dirt separation with hydraulic separation. I'd rather see fittings and zone/isolation/balancing valves and flow meters as separate parts vs an engineered manifold with proprietary parts that might disappear.
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Nobody wants to thread 4"
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You could use 4" black and put Victaulic mechanical tees on. There like saddle taps. You just hole saw the holes in the pipe and bolt them on. That's the best way to do hot water and cheaper than welding and getting them aligned is easy.
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Isn't this hot water with like 1.25" near boiler piping?
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@ebebratt-ed I priced it for mechanical tee's but having 7 takeoffs on each manifold with mechanical tee's is kinda going to make it look ridiculous, in my opinion. Having the welder do threadolets is really not going to cost that much more. Mechanical tee's are 5X cost of a threadolets. the rest will be done in grooved. 2 RBI boilers with buffer tank, air separator, etc. the issue is space. The job is in the basement of Cheers (RIP George). absolutely no space. I have a plan
@mattmia2- its a 4" supply and return. seven story building.
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you could run some large branches and put the manifolds on remote locations if you can find spaces for that. might ultimately take up a lot less of the basement if everything doesn't have to home run to the boiler.
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