Old Boiler Completely Blocked with Soot and Blew out Pilot
I have a U.S. National Gas Boiler from 1962. 127.000 BTU's.
I kept it up well, and over the last 10 years I replaced the gas Valve, Pilot Assembly, Automatic Water Feeder, McDonnel Miller 67 low water cut off, drain valve, Pressuretrol, and even the pressure relief valve. (15 psi)
I never cleaned the top of the boiler down. I only cleaned the burners and never had any issues. I owned it 30 years since I been here.
When I would look under the burners, everything looked clean.
Sunday morning, I came home and the boiler was off. I went down to see why and when I took the side panel off there was about an inch of Soot all on top of the burners and the bottom of the boiler. I looked at the bottom of the Boiler Sections and there was a 1/2 inch of Soot covering them. That was not there 3 months ago when I got it ready for Winter.
I vacuumed it all up and lit the pilot. The pilot assembly was all black from Soot. I lit it, turned on the gas, and nothing but low yellow flames were swirling around.
I got scared since I know this Boiler like the back of my hand but never seen this or knew about the Soot. I called out a Company supposed to be a Pro with great reviews.
He took the top of the boiler cover off (Probably 1st time since it was put in in 1962) and it was completely blocked with Soot.
He said it's a mess to clean it and stared at it for a bout 10 minutes. I know he did not want to mess with it. He said easiest way is to flush it with water. I told him go ahead; I will suck up all the water with a Shop Vac since no drain was nearby.
After about 25 minutes it was perfectly clean. He put everything back and had a hard time lighting the pilot. He got it lit, and it had great nice blue flames. The last few years I always had mostly yellow flames. No matter how I adjusted the air on each tube, they stayed yellow. I have not seen this blue in years. I asked him to check the flue with is meter and let me know if it's all in specs with the Temperature, CO2 and other numbers. He said "I left my Combustion Analyzer in another truck".
Next day I came home it was out again. I had to change the thermocouple. Whatever explosion happened that knocked down all that Soot must have messed it up.
Boiler is working now so far.
Flames are nice and blue like they should be. No more yellow like I had for the last 5 years or so.
My questions is this……
He said I need a new boiler. This one might Soot up and block up and do the same thing again. Could be a week, month, or a year.
The draft into the chimney is perfect. No problems.
How did this Soot get so bad so fast in 3 months that it completely blocked like that? Was is my neglect cleaning it from the top all this time and it just "Escalated" that fast ?
3 months ago the bottom of the boiler was perfectly clean. All of a sudden 1/2 inch of Soot.
Like I mentioned though, flames have been yellow before this for a few years and no matter how much I turned the adjusters on the burners, it had no effect at all.
He quoted me between $-$ for a new boiler. Didn't ask him what brand or what. I know I would get a few other bids if and when I replace this one maybe in the spring.
Thing is he said, "once a boiler builds up Soot it will do it faster because its old, it might plug up again in a few weeks or months".
Burnham or Weil-McLain better?
I'm thinking of maybe calling someone out for another opinion to check the flue gases and stuff but I know they will tell me "Time for a new one".
Comments
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You need to find someone that understands combustion. If a hot water boiler is condensing a lot it can soot while burning correctly but a steam boiler should be hot enough to avoid sustained condensing. I suppose something else could have blocked the hx then the soot formed because it wasn't burning correctly but you really need someone that knows what they are doing to look at it.
0 -
Take a deep breath.
If the boiler sections were never cleaned in 60 years how could it not have soot? Of course it will after 60 years any boiler will have soot.
If it is clean now and the flame look good and blue you are probably fine
The tech you had is an idiot and should have come back and retested it with his analyzer.
He is just trying to sell you a new boiler
At over 60 years old you should think about replacement (budget for it) have it combustion tested by someone that knows what they are doing and if ok keep running it
Boiler do not ware out and shouldn't need replacement if not leaking
5 -
No a boiler doesn't soot up because its "old" or because it sooted up before. It took years for the soot to collect, and now it'll take years for the soot to collect again.
Now you know annual cleaning INCLUDES brushing/vacuuming the heat exchanger. 😉
A combustion and draft test are in order however. But get another tech, the one you had was just a boiler salesman.
Trying to squeeze the best out of a Weil-McLain JB-5 running a 1912 1 pipe system.2 -
Thank you for all your reply's.
I agree, not knowing I should have checked from the top down for at least 30 years was an issue. I thought I knew everything about proper cleaning, and I was wrong.
3 months ago I was planning on calling someone to come out and do a "Combustion Test".
When this happened, I said "Ok, If I have to pay someone let them use their equipment that I don't have, so they can adjust the burners, gas pressure, and tune it the best they can".
I live on the South Side of Chicago. So many "Professionals" that been in business so long and profess they know about Steam actually don't know nothing.
About 10 years ago I called about replacing my boiler. Guy was an old timer that was honest. He asked me why I want to replace my boiler. I told him because it's 50 years old. He said "Is the boiler leaking water"? I said "No". He said save your money, if it's not leaking you don't need a boiler.
6 years ago I was sick and bed bound lying in bed 24 -7. Once in a while I would hear a loud "Bang". Like an explosion in the basement. I was able to come down and took a vent off a radiator. Steam blew out of it 8 feet.
I knew right away the Pressuretrol was bad. I called out a "Professional" and told him "Change the Pressuretrol."
He came out and tried to tell me a Radiator vent must be blocked.
I told him to get a Presuretrol and install it. I had the old Mercury Type probably from 1962.
Owner called and said "I can't allow him to install it because that's not the problem. You have a clogged Vent on 1 of your Radiators".
I got into it with him. I told him "even if I closed off every radiator in this house, no way should it build up pressure past 1.5 I have it set for. Pressuretrol checks the pressure of the boiler, not a radiator vent" Clown told me I'm not a professional.
4 -
@The Steam Whisperer services the South Side. Look him up on the "find a contractor" feature on this site. Knows his stuff.
We're on the North Side and I could tell you stories about the various yahoos that came to "service" my MIL's boilers.🙄
Trying to squeeze the best out of a Weil-McLain JB-5 running a 1912 1 pipe system.1 -
Probably nothing wrong with the mercury switch pressuretrol, probably the pigtail was clogged.
5 -
Pigtail was clean. That was the 1st thing I checked.
1 -
Sometimes the diaphragm gives out on those.
Trying to squeeze the best out of a Weil-McLain JB-5 running a 1912 1 pipe system.0 -
I know exactly what you are talking about. I asked the Pro from the youtube channel "Silent Steam Team" my issue. He told me to contact "The Steam Whisperer."
I looked him up and he is the best in Chicago.
Going to call them. He comes out and tells me tells me I need a Boiler, I trust him.
Like you said…. To many Yahoos out there saying they know all about Steam Heat and know nothing.2 -
Call @The Steam Whisper.
It's good that you have someone who knows there stuff to come out.
2 -
I'm in the near west suburbs, the Steam Whisper is the only guys who touch my boiler.
1 -
Thank you everyone,
Beginning of next week I'm definitely going to call and have The Steam Whisper guy come out and do a Combustion Test.
On Youtube another Pro Steam guy I asked and he said call "The Steam Whisper guy and have him come out and test it.
About 6 years ago I was sick and bed bound being misdiagnosed with a really bad Gallbladder.
I couldn't even go down in the basement. I would hear the boiler "Bang" like an explosion. I took a Radiator Vent off and Steam blew about 8 feet across the room.
I knew it was the Pressuretrol. I called some other supposed "Pro" from the South Side that been in business 40 years. Guy comes out, I showed him the pressure from the radiator when I took a vent off. It was a very cold day.
I made it down to the basement should him the pressure. Guage was not working ( I replaced it since)
I told him "Change the Pressuretrol". He starts playing with the blow down, drained water, then he wanted to overfill the boiler with more water to see what happens, I told him "NO' that's not the problem. Then he wanted to crank up the gas pressure to see what happens. I told him not to touch it.
His conclusion was "I have a clogged Radiator Vent". He didn't have a Pressuretrol he said he can get one and put it on in the morning. I said fine, do it.
The owner calls me 2 hours later. He tells me "I can't have my guy change a part that is not bad, you have a clogged radiator vent somewhere and I'm not going to allow him to change your Pressuretrol since there is nothing wrong with it".
I was smoking hot !
I told him his guy don't know what he is doing, and he don't know anything.
I explained to him my mercury Pressuretrol was set for about 1.2 PSI. The boiler had at least 10lbs. of pressure in it since it was so cold, vents were all closed and it kept trying to run to keep up with the Temperature in the house. I told him if I closed every radiator, If I blocked the header coming off the boiler, that boiler would shut off at 1.2 psi. I told him the Pressuretrol checks boiler pressure, not radiator pressure because of a clogged air vent. Every raidiator is hot.
The guy told me I don't know what I'm talking about, him and his guys are the Pros. I hung up on him.
Had my nephew get a Pressuretrol, showed him how to change it, problem solved.
That's what we deal with on the South Side of Chicago.
Calling the Steam Whisperer
Thank You all1
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