Lochinvar Noble new install questions: system supply sensor, circulator pump, and general feedback

in my personal opinion I would call them back and have the work done correctly underneath the boiler

There are no service valves installed to descale the unit on the domestic side

There are no isolation valves on the heating supply/return under the unit

There is what looks like Black Fittings on the HW side of the domestic which needs to be replaced. Should never have black fittings on domestic water

you will get the most out of it if you read through the control adjustment section of the manual. Then you can make the final adjustments to get it dialed it to your home.

Is it fin tube baseboard in the home?

To me, that 100% looks like a Black Tee on the Hot Water outlet. It should be a service valve regardless but that needs to be removed. They should never have installed that

Black iron is…iron. Ferrous metal and should be magnetic. You also see that the black "T" is on the port labelled "Domestic Hot Water Out." The black iron "T" has a brass TPRV threaded into it. GroundUp is right about the system sensor. But you should connect the ODR sensor and program the boiler on the right "curve" that suits your form of radiation and desires for heat.

you’re over thinking this whole magnetic thing, it’s irrelevant, unless there is a very strange flash, that’s a Black Malleable Tee, not allowed on domestic water in any way shape or form. It will not only rot out and cause a leak, possibly damage your unit, it will create rust/corrosion inside the water & lines inside your house. The picture I added is what should be installed there

I don't know what kind of metals they are casting "T's" out of in Vietnam.

SP114 is stainless. Sure looks like malleable, but the numbers say otherwise which coincides with the lack of magnetism.

As for "why wouldn't raising delta T be helpful?", I'll ask again why you think it would. The boiler runs off of outlet temp and will modulate as necessary to meet that temp. If the flow is slowed through the load to raise delta there, there would just be more recycling of the boiler water between the closely spaced tees and the only outcome you'd have is a cooler temp in the room(s) at the end of your loops. A small delta (within reason) is always ideal for baseboard systems. The system sensor again serves no purpose because the temp is regulated by the boiler's internal sensor. If there were multiple boilers injecting into a large system loop, that system temp would override the boiler temps to maintain setpoint. As a single boiler system like this, the onboard sensor is already doing the job and there is no use for the system sensor.

Delta T is your friend, essentially free fuel savings. About the only exception to it is with long baseboard loops where a higher delta T will cause the last couple of emitters to put out much less heat.

To get the most out of a modcon, you always want as high of a delta T as you can get away with. With baseboards, I would start at 10F and increase from there if you don't have heating issues.

Don't know about that specific boiler, but most with internal pumps can target a deltaT. You would then adjust the secondary pump with all zones open to match this delta T, this is why you want an adjustable pump. Either deltP or delta T circ works, whicher your installer prefers.

+1 on getting proper isolation valve setup on the DHW side. This is a must for any instantiations water heater.

looks like an old discolored brass tee? Which would be non magnetic also.

Its a form of doublethink, both right and wrong at the same time.

As an installer, you don't want callbacks. Setting the pumps to max and using no or conservative reset curve will mean the unit will just work and most imporat, it will work the same as the boiler it replaced.

As and end user, I want to squeeze every last bit of heat out of that fuel burned especially if it is a matter of turning some valves and adjusting some settings. For example, I was running a 40F delta on my boiler before it got replaced with an AWHP. Even went as far as turning up the supply temp so I could run a higher delta, thus lower RWT to increase condensation. When the boiler fired, condensate was gushing out. This was with high mass emitters, so more forgiving and it took a bit of fiddling but it worked.

The boiler circ is not variable speed, so changing the output of the emitters is going to gain nothing in the form of efficiency because boiler temps will still be the same as they are now. Literally the only difference you'd notice with a larger delta T in the heating loops is cooler rooms. Efficiency will stay the same. You're welcome to spend a bunch of money on a delta T circ if you want, but you'd gain more by setting the money on fire and using it to heat the house.

Those were separate issues. Take a look at the install manual and you'll see that the tees need to be within 4 pipe diameters of each other with no elbows in between

This falls into that category that techincally it is wrong, but it doesn't matter. Your space heat loads are low enough that you don't need full flow there.

The laws of physics and thermodynamics don't really have any "loop-holes."

It was a simple misprint. The rule of thermodynamics doesn't care if there is one zone or several- hydraulic separation is an absolute necessity with a system like this and you don't really have it. It's all about minimizing pressure drop between the tees which is why they're supposed to be only 4 pipe diameters apart (12" rule would only apply if the system piping were 3" or larger) so in your case with what appears to be 1" piping, the tees should not be more than 4 inches apart while you effectively have 4 times that or more after elbows are considered.

@hot_rod how would you propose that a 30* delta through a combi boiler is accomplished while the load delta is 5* or even 10*, without use of a highly stratified buffer tank?