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Triangle Tube won't start when system cool

Rich Davis_2
Rich Davis_2 Member Posts: 121
in Gas Heating

My Triangle Tube PS60 won't run when system is cool, when system cools off during the day to close to ambient it will hard lock-out E-02, it usually starts when I hit reset and runs fine, if the system stays hot (running Frequently) it usually starts. Checked the ingniter wasn't to bad but cleaned it anyway, checked gas supply 12wc, max 13wc, checked combustion O2 7.2% max 4.7% and CO2 9.7% and min 10.7%. Does anyone have any ideas? Thanks guys, youse always come thru.

Comments

  • Alan (California Radiant) Forbes
    Alan (California Radiant) Forbes Member Posts: 4,241
    edited October 2024

    Natural gas or propane? Sounds like propane.

    E02 is a false flame signal.

    8.33 lbs./gal. x 60 min./hr. x 20°ΔT = 10,000 BTU's/hour

    Two btu per sq ft for degree difference for a slab
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 9,681
    edited October 2024

    I don't know if this uses the spark rod as the flame sensor rod, but if it does not, try cleaning the flame sensor rod also.

    It looks like the Ignition electrode is also the flame sensor so scratch that idea. Does the electrode look worn? Perhaps a new ignition assembly and Ignition wire. I have experienced where the wire has enough continuity to spark at 6000 volts but not enough continuity to measure the flame signal back to the control (milliamps) Here are the part numbers.

    Screenshot 2024-10-23 at 3.04.15 PM.png

    Those parts are less expensive. If that fails, then you can start to look at the burner head, control board, and the other more expensive parts. process of elimination: Start with cleaning, then the cheap parts then the expensive parts.

    Edward Young Retired

    After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?

  • Rich Davis_2
    Rich Davis_2 Member Posts: 121

    It is propane, are you saying that the igniter is also a flame sensor, what is the sensor that is located at the top of the heat exchanger NTC sensor PSRKIT04 I thought that might be a flame sensor. I replaced both the ignitor and cable last season

  • GGross
    GGross Member Posts: 1,357
    https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1815861#Comment_1815861

    PSRKIT04 (replaced by PTRKIT122 fyi) is a supply or return temp sensor. This senses water temperature and does not interact with the burner chamber

  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 9,681
    edited October 2024

    The flame sensors on most new residential (and many commercial) systems use Flame Rectification as proof of flame.  That is where an AC current is sent to the Flame. The flame acts as a conductor and a rectifier that converts the AC signal to a DC signal and travels back to the control by the chassis ground.  That said, the signal that returns to the control must be properly grounded thru the burner housing metal, and all the screws and joints that hold all the metal parts together back to the control board where there is a chassis ground connection.  

    You could have some rusted joints or corroded screws that are not making a good ground connection.  If the heater has any corrosion on it due to being in a moist damp basement, you may have a grounding problem.  I have fixed that problem with running a dedicated ground wire from the screws that holds the ignitor in place on the burner all the way back to the ground on the control board. 

    Boiler temperature can account for some movement in the boiler parts making a better contact when warm and not so good when cold. I have highlighted a place where you may be able to add an additional green ground wire to the control by placing a wire on the X1 plug on wire #6 OR on the G terminal where the 120VAC current is connected.

    Screenshot 2024-10-23 at 5.14.50 PM.png

    the other end of the green wire should be connected to the screw on the ignitor itself.

    I have looked everywhere to see where the wiring connections in the boiler may actually be, however there are no photos that indicate where that is. You will need to find them on your boiler based on the wiring diagram only. Or you can send pictures

    Edward Young Retired

    After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?

  • Rich Davis_2
    Rich Davis_2 Member Posts: 121

    Thanks, will check it out, I'll get back to ya.

  • Rich Davis_2
    Rich Davis_2 Member Posts: 121

    Well finally had time to work on the boiler, done what Ed suggested and ran another ground wire from the igniter to the screw that has all the ground wires running to it. Last year I wasn't able to get the right numbers for the combustion, so I called TT and talked to an engineer and told him that I couldn't get the combustion right he suggested the blower wasn't turning fast enough and seeing how it was over 10 years old, he suggested replacing it. I bought one to install at a later date. So I installed it along with removing the burner to check and see if it looked OK. Everything looked fine, I noticed on the inside of the burner there were holes spaced out around the inside and then there were a line of holes so I positioned the burner so the line of holes were lined up with the inginator. So replacing the blower, running an extra ground, seemed to do the trick, for now, it fires first try and the combustion numbers are where they should be. So THANKS, very much appreciated

    SteveC

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