Underslab Plumbing
Comments
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I prefer vertical vent takeoffs, but sometimes it can make things very difficult and is not advisable. If you’re fighting grade and need to keep your drain high, you’re forced to have some horizontal venting. With my work above, a lot more excavation would have been necessary for vertical venting and the sewer ejector would have been in a very deep pit.
Vertical wet venting sure is a time saver and can theoretically keep a vent clean, but practically, it can build up soap scum and hair, reducing the effectiveness of the vent.8.33 lbs./gal. x 60 min./hr. x 20°ΔT = 10,000 BTU's/hour
Two btu per sq ft for degree difference for a slab0 -
That said, I'm looking at the code book and see that a few changes have been made since I was active. They now allow horizontal wet venting.
8.33 lbs./gal. x 60 min./hr. x 20°ΔT = 10,000 BTU's/hour
Two btu per sq ft for degree difference for a slab0 -
I REALLY hate going to The Box stores, but we all have to nights, weekends, or if it's RIGHT near your job. Their prices are not always the lowest either..Mad Dog
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horizontal venting is not code compliant unless it is a wet vent. if it gets plugged you can snake it . if the vent you installed it cant be. that being said alot of inspectors let it go anyway
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they aways allowed horizontal wet venting. but they dont allow dry venting.. please post pictures from a code book a drawing is useless. newer said their prices are the lowest. but saving an hour of my time is worth paying a little more
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"Unless prohibited by structural conditions, each vent shall rise vertically…."
I guess a slab is not a "structural condition", so maybe I've done it wrong all these years.
Show us how you would have done it, mikedo. Just remember, this kind of piping arrangement would require another 18" of soil to be excavated.
8.33 lbs./gal. x 60 min./hr. x 20°ΔT = 10,000 BTU's/hour
Two btu per sq ft for degree difference for a slab0 -
what does the 2 inch line that we cant see terminate
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That’s for the kitchen sink.
8.33 lbs./gal. x 60 min./hr. x 20°ΔT = 10,000 BTU's/hour
Two btu per sq ft for degree difference for a slab0 -
I've been venting WC and tubs, showers like this for many years. How else would you do this with plumbing in a slab?
The key is the vent takes off above the centerline of the waste line as it offsets.
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream
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Hot Rod is correct. As long as the tee wye or wye is skewed up so that the bull is breaking vertically past the 3 or 9 o clock orientation is of the horizontal, that will meet minimum standard. I do this only when I have no choice.
- First choice 90 degree vertically 12 o clock
- Second Choice..roll up with a 45.
- Third choice..roll up with a 22 1/2
- Skew it...
Mad Dog
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if you look at the picture i posted its not legal if its a dry vent dosent matter if it comes off the top a vent can only go horizotal if it is a wet vent. im assuming the bathroom has only 1 sink if so you can vent it with a single vent off the sink and the kitchen sink can go into the wet vent if it has its own individual vent. venting of plumbing fixtures is very confusing there are many things to consider. i cant find a good picture were this exact situation is explained.i hope people dont think im trying to be a jerk im only trying to help i think the 2 guys that helped me understand this are deceased i was shocked when they educated me at how much i didnt understand about the codes. you could probally write a book about venting alone unfortunately im not smart enough to do it. my wife would be happy to confirm that
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This is from NJ code 2021 edition. This is NOT the code the OP is following, but I didn't have time to look up CA code. That said, their venting rules generally don't differ that much.
In the section picture it says you can wet vent a floor drain, not that you have to.
All I get from this code is they want the vent to be able to drain.
Single pipe 392sqft system with an EG-40 rated for 325sqft and it's silent and balanced at all times.
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looks legal in that code book what book is it
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i saw its the national standard plumbing code legal in californa and some other states. it would be nice if the code was used in the whole usa
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No, what I posted is NJ's modified NPSC which isn't in use in CA anymore that I know of. CA uses modified UPC.
However this is from CA's 2022 code book
UPC doesn't really have much detail when it comes to venting. It's kind of short and sweet.
Single pipe 392sqft system with an EG-40 rated for 325sqft and it's silent and balanced at all times.
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Here's CA's 2022 code book
Single pipe 392sqft system with an EG-40 rated for 325sqft and it's silent and balanced at all times.
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It is the interconnection of the vents that the 6 inches above flood rim matter. Vents by their natural travel below the flood rim of a fixture.
Cost is what you spend , value is what you get.
cell # 413-841-6726
https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/charles-garrity-plumbing-and-heating1 -
Two predominate plumbing codes in the US now, I think both UPS and IPC are under IAMPO.
There are different versions of the code, we are still on 2021 here even though there is a 2024.
A State or town can adopt all or,part of a code, they can add addendums specific to the area. So it is not as simple as saying what code the AHJ is using.
States like Wisconsin that have their own codes are usually still based on UPC or IPC.
Typically the IPC has been less stringent in venting requirements, FU and lengths, etc.
To me it is only a wet vent if another fixture drains into it.
Just because a vent for a shower or tub is run horizontal to get to the nearest wall, doesn't mean it is a wet vent. Although it could be called a flat vent. Different lingo used, to describe vents.
Wet vented sections need to be one size larger, so a 1-1/2" lav p trap could drain into a 2" WC vent, in some instances. A portion of the WC vent that sees the lav discharge is considered the "wet" vented section.
Most all the codes have illustrated guides to help clear up the intent.
If there is room in a basement or crawl we would dump the lav into a low heel ell, placed under the lav sink wall.
. We called this a vertical wet vent as it served the lav drain and the WC vent. A toilet wa conidered a clean out for those two change of direction ell.
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream
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nice to know that info thanks. i betting that alot of inspectors would let go when using the ipc if you showed them it was legal in alot of the country . its not a safety issue and ultimately its up to the discretion of the code official
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But a Single Uniform code would make sense....so you can forget it...Mad Dog
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add another layer of question, that being the actual inspector that shows up. Various inspectors in the same jurstriction may have different opinions of proper, or at least acceptable venting practices.
I did a training two weeks ago for the UAMPO group, Utah plumbing and mechanical inspectors. By the questions in the room it was clear no one had a complete grasp on the requirements for backflow and PRV applications and listing numbers.
Myself included😣
But they wanted the info or at least a place to go to get the correct application data.
Bob "hot rod" Rohr
trainer for Caleffi NA
Living the hydronic dream1 -
Each inspector, even in large Municipalities, have their, own specific pet peeves. Unfortunately, we don't often learn them until they come for the first inspection. Mad Dog
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Difference in inspector ideals is why the first plumbers to start continuing education were the inspectors. While not a perfect system they are put one the same page and get bad translation of the code out of the way more frequently.
Cost is what you spend , value is what you get.
cell # 413-841-6726
https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/charles-garrity-plumbing-and-heating1 -
Many years ago, I had an SF inspector fail a washing machine rupture pan that we had fabricated. He said it didn't have a UPC stamp and we had to remove it. He said it was considered a plumbing fixture and it had to be approved. That one bothered me.
8.33 lbs./gal. x 60 min./hr. x 20°ΔT = 10,000 BTU's/hour
Two btu per sq ft for degree difference for a slab2 -
had an inspector insist i put a pan in for the washer on the second floor it was not code to do it. i said the people dont want to pay for it but if the town would im sure they would let them do it. he kept busting my balls luckly their were two plumbing inspectors and the other guy sided with me saying it wasnt code so i didnt have to do it.
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The IRC & IPC are in force where I work in CT. They are almost identical in their plumbing requirements.
No inspector in my state should stray from the defined & documented principles that I use as a guide when pricing residential work, regardless of the jurisdiction.
In the rare case where my code compliant install doesn't meet an inspectors peeve or opinion, or I'm subject to unconstructive criticism, I politely ask for a reference to the written section of code in question.
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I've found the best inspectors are guys who had their own, successful businesses for atleast 10-15 years. They've been there, are reasonable and not weenies. Quite a few are on delusional power trips. Mad Dog
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Inspectors are people, good apples bad apples. But I understand how some started to act the way they do, especially when 90% (made up number) of the jobs you go to inspect are hack jobs trying to hide stuff, argue with you and give attitude. As always, the good plumbers get the shaft..
Main frustration I see nowadays is when Con Ed makes rules DOB doesn't approve.
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