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The marraige of a 100 year old gravity system and a new biomass setup.

Harvey Ramer
Harvey Ramer Member Posts: 2,217
This Econoburn and design gets shipped out to MD.

A rather simple design, by homeowner request. Thought it sounded a bit ironic, coming from the lips of an electrical engineer who played a large part in getting our nation's first satellite in orbit.

By the way, I won't be doing the install. Any heating contractors close to Thurmont MD, speak up!

Harvey

Comments

  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 14,871
    Nice, it must be fun to do a design and see how the installer translate it. Hopefully you get paid well for you time and expertise.

    This Thursday "Coffee with Caleffi" webinar will be on buffer tanks and some different options for piping that are a bit unusual.

    This hybrid method takes some of then pipe and fittings out, compared to RR. It also maintains the stratification better, less flow thru then tanks when the distribution pump is running.

    The biggest feature, especially with slow starting biomass, is the heat energy goes directly to the load without needing to get the tanks hot first. In the webinar, Siggy will talk about the math that shows how the flow rate thru the tank differs from RR.

    Just another option to have in your quiver.
    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
    Harvey Ramer
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 14,770
    Thurmont isn't that far from Baltimore, but we're booked out till mid-September :/
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
    Harvey Ramer
  • Harvey Ramer
    Harvey Ramer Member Posts: 2,217
    Bob,
    I like that hybrid setup but it doesn't really work on this job as the 2 tanks will be setting too far apart.

    The way I have been doing it, also allows for immediate system loading with any excess heat being deposited in the tanks. I know it takes a couple more fittings, however, with this setup I am able to isolate a tank for service, repair or replacement without shutting the system down. That may prove convenient for someone after I am dead. lol

    The biggest quandary I currently face is how to properly control the boiler pump to achieve good stratification in the tanks. The low mass wood boilers like the pump to stay running. To further compound the issue, they have no automatic means of detecting when the fire in the box is depleted, allowing the pump to be shut off. And then we throw in a backup boiler, eliminating the possibility of a temperature responsive pump. I have thought long and hard but haven't come up with the ideal solution yet. Perhaps someone else has? If so, I would love to hear it.

    I have had Coffee with Calleffi a few times, but 99% of the time I am hard at work when it all happens. I go back and view some of the webinars though. Always good stuff!

    And yes, I most certainly do get compensated for this work. That is the only way.

    That's to bad Frank. I think this guy wants his heat in and working before mid September.
  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 14,871
    You always has something fun going on for work, good news.

    It looks like they want a somewhat manual system, shuffling between the two boilers with hand operated valves?

    Another option would be a motorized 3 way zone valve. When the wood boiler drops to say 120F the valve moves to the fossil fueled boiler and drops power to the wood boiler pump and combustion fan if it has one.

    Is a single tank and option? You can get about 435 gallons in a room 8 feet tall, and thru a 36" door. These guys make a nice price point pressurized tank for wood and biomass installations.


    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream